| EXCALIBUR |
Just came back from Costco. They stock Mobile 1 10w-30, 6qts./$23.99 ($4.00/qt.) and Chevron Supreme 5w-30, 12 qts/$11.29 ($.94/qt.). I plan to change the oil on my MDX at 7,500 miles and the same intervals thereafter. I know the recommended oil viscosity for the MDX is 5w-20 and the oil cap recommends 5w-30. Both are close enough for me. This poses several questions:
Q: Which of the two previously mentioned motor oils should I use?
Q: Is the Mobile 1 10w-30 safe to use (viscosity-wise) and is it what most members that run synthetic oil use?
Q: Would it be better to run Chevron Supreme 5w-30 and change it at 3,750 mile intervals?
Q: Mobile 1 costs 4 times more than Chevron Supreme...is it worth it?
Q: Would it follow that Mobile 1 would last 4 times longer than Chevron Supreme and therefore require less frequent changes?
Here's welcoming your comments and recommendations. Members? :confused: |
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| BaldEagle |
quote:
Originally posted by EXCALIBUR
. I know the recommended oil viscosity for the MDX is 5w-20 and the oil cap reccomends 5w-30.
The owners manual was changed in mid 2002 and now recommends 5w-30, the same as the oil cap.
For me most (at least 2/3rds) of my miles are normal usage and
I am going to change with non synthetic oil every 5000 miles.
The taxi cab test that Consumers Reports did a few years ago indicated to me that:
1. 3000 mile oil changes are an overkill for modern engines.
2. Synthetic oils are a waste of money. |
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| rvehock |
| I buy Mobil 1 5W-30 (5 quart bottle) at Walmart for $17. I would say that if your oil chage frequency is only 3,750, the Chevron may be OK for you. I use Mobil 1 because I go longer than 3750 miles between oil changes. |
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| EXCALIBUR |
BaldEagle & rvehock,
If I were to go with the Chevron Supreme 5w-30, would it be safe to change oil at 7,500 mile intervals or would 5,000 miles be better (all things being equal). |
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| JTM |
I got my oil from costco as well.....
but I was using regular Mobil 5w-30 oil for the first 15K with 3750 oil change interval. Now I switch to Mobil 1 5w-30 @ 15K and planning to change it every 5000 miles. |
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| xcel |
Hi All:
___160,000 + from a Mercury Sable with 7500 mile changes using whatever was on sale, 172,000 from the Toyota Previa w/ 7500 mile changes using whatever was on sale, and 160,000 + from the Honda Accord w/ 7500 + mile changes using whatever was on sale. No engine oil related troubles on any of these 3 vehicles … Is the MDX unusually sensitive or is it everyone’s imagination?
___Good Luck
___Wayne R. Gerdes
___Hunt Club Farms Landscaping Ltd.
___Waynegerdes@earthlink.net |
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| DaleB |
| Both are excellent products. |
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| EXCALIBUR |
quote:
Originally posted by JTM
I got my oil from costco as well.....
but I was using regular Mobil 5w-30 oil for the first 15K with 3750 oil change interval. Now I switch to Mobil 1 5w-30 @ 15K and planning to change it every 5000 miles.
You are fortunate that your Costco carries Mobil 1 5w-30. The Costco in my area stocks only Mobile 1 10w-30. |
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| EXCALIBUR |
quote:
Originally posted by xcel
Hi All:
___160,000 + from a Mercury Sable with 7500 mile changes using whatever was on sale, 172,000 from the Toyota Previa w/ 7500 mile changes using whatever was on sale, and 160,000 + from the Honda Accord w/ 7500 + mile changes using whatever was on sale. No engine oil related troubles on any of these 3 vehicles … Is the MDX unusually sensitive or is it everyone’s imagination?
___Good Luck
___Wayne R. Gerdes
___Hunt Club Farms Landscaping Ltd.
___Waynegerdes@earthlink.net
From what you are saying, it seems like the key to longevity is the regular change of oil at 7,500 miles itself. |
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| EXCALIBUR |
quote:
Originally posted by DaleB
Both are excellent products.
That being said, it seems that the Chevron Supreme 5w-30 would be the way to go. It is cheaper than Mobile 1 10w-30, it is the recommended viscosity for the MDX, and it should last up to 7,500 mile oil changes. Does this make sense? |
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| JimH |
| Yes---and just change it earlier if it looks dirty and/or you have extreme use in towing/heat, etc. |
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| ardvarkus |
quote:
Originally posted by xcel
Hi All:
___160,000 + from a Mercury Sable with 7500 mile changes using whatever was on sale, 172,000 from the Toyota Previa w/ 7500 mile changes using whatever was on sale, and 160,000 + from the Honda Accord w/ 7500 + mile changes using whatever was on sale. No engine oil related troubles on any of these 3 vehicles … Is the MDX unusually sensitive or is it everyone’s imagination?
Amen!
I do a 5000 intereval on all my vehciles, unless I've been towing/in extreme heat..
It is the changing that is critical! I am always amazed at the number of owners who fork over the bucks to use synthetics every 5k miles, yet only use regular ATF, and then only have the dealer do it at the max interval... In my mind, the longer the service interval, the more appropriate synthetic use becomes.
(Plenty on this board on ATF, frequency, Honda versus syn, etc...just commenting)
I think the 'end of life' on mostl vehicles is not motor oil related...
Ard |
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| DaleB |
quote:
Originally posted by ardvarkus
It is the changing that is critical! I am always amazed at the number of owners who fork over the bucks to use synthetics every 5k miles, yet only use regular ATF, and then only have the dealer do it at the max interval.
Ard
I am not amazed at all. What tells me a synthetic ATF is better than what Honda recommends? So far nothing.
There are tests showing the differences in motor oils between synthetic and conventional, but I've never seen any for ATF which embodies many unique properties depending on the particular transmission design.
I am not about to try a different brand, synthetic are not, when Honda is very specific about the using theirs. No one can say with certainly that their recommendation is not totally valid, and not just a means to sell their own brand.
Going 30K, and with a flush instead of a simple drain is going beyond severe service recommendations IMHO. |
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| ardvarkus |
quote:
Originally posted by DaleB
I am not amazed at all. What tells me a synthetic ATF is better than what Honda recommends? So far nothing.
There are tests showing the differences in motor oils between synthetic and conventional, but I've never seen any for ATF which embodies many unique properties depending on the particular transmission design.
I am not about to try a different brand, synthetic are not, when Honda is very specific about the using theirs. No one can say with certainly that their recommendation is not totally valid, and not just a means to sell their own brand.
Going 30K, and with a flush instead of a simple drain is going beyond severe service recommendations IMHO.
So, since you’ve never seen it, it must not exist or be true?
Really, it isn’t worth my time to find the information on-line that describes the benefits of Synthetic ATF over conventional- it’s higer resistance to thermal breakdown specifically… because then someone will state “sure, but what about in an Acura transmission” then they will say, “sure, but what about in the MDX?”… and then, “sure, what about in the 2001 MDX?”
Does anyone have data on the benefit of synthetic motor oil in an MDX engine? Of course not.
For every quart of ATF they sell 20 quarts of motor oil- they’ll spend their marketing dollars convincing yuppies it is critical to have. (Before we flame, I agree it is superior, but not that it is needed.)
BTW, I agree that “Going 30K, and with a flush instead of a simple drain” IS beyond the severe service recommendation. But I think it is appropriate given the POTENTIAL issues with this trans (and any AT in a very hot environment.) After all, who would go 30k on motor oil? (Yes, I know, motor oil is subject to the combustion process, and more dramatic stresses...but still)
Personally, I also would NOT switch to a synthetic in the MDX until I was clear of the warranty period.
Or are you just yanking my chain? :)
Ard |
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| DaleB |
No chain yanking going on here....engine oils work much the same in any engine, but transmissions must have specific friction modifiers. I know you know that, Ard, better than me probably.
I like the additional margin of synthetics and am not about to change. And I used Syn. ATF in previous vehicles, but the requirements were well defined, and were usually the 'standard' Mercon II, or III, or something else if it was a Toyota, etc.
That does not seem to be the case with Honda products. I know I mentioned on here before, there are some unique properties which may have nothing to do with the transmission itself, but transaxle or transfer assembly requirements.
I plan to extend the warranty, so will likely keep using Honda's fluid. We don't even know if it might not be a synthetic, or blend. It should be for they charge! |
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| ardvarkus |
Agreed. for the MDX the ATF is a bit of a different beast...
BTW, I've found that Mobil 1 ATF, with Lubeguard 'black' ATF addititve as a friction modifier can be 'adjusted' to vary shift quality... In my Q45 I've used around 4 oz per fill to cut down on 1-2 shift harshness under 3/4 throttle....pretty remarkable effect, actually.
But that pup is not under warranty!
Ard |
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| BlueStreak |
My father-in-law is a pertoleum engineer so I take his advice. Engine oil is so much better today than it was just 5 years ago. 3k changes are indeed overkill for most applications. 5-7.5k changes will work fine using a good API-rated oil. The main issue with oil is contaminants, and to change on a regular basis. He does recommend using a good filter (many threads currently on filters).
He recommends syn oil only in extreme applications or where the engine is going to be worked hard. Do we drive like this to work every day - not likely. Some motors, due to high temps and revs recommend syn oil, and in those appls use it.
If you shop around you will find syn oil on sale. Late last year Wally World was selling Penzoil Syn for 3.34 a bottle, and the mfg had a $1 rebate per quart - no limit. So will I use syn for 2.34 a bottle - you bet.
I routinely keep my vehicles (GM, Ford, and Honda) 150k miles and over and in 25 years I've never had an oil-related problem doing regular maint. Key is regular maint.
-Greg
03 SS/Quartz/Nav/Res |
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| EXCALIBUR |
BlueStreak,
Given the improved quality of today's motor oils, some of us do not put a lot of mileage on our MDX's each year. In other words, it takes a lot of time to hit 5,000 or 7,500 miles. That being said, should we consider a time schedule e.g. every 6 months or once a year for oil changes instead of a mileage schedule?:confused: |
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| BlueStreak |
Assuming you drive the vehicle and let the oil (and the motor) reach operating temps for 20 minutes or so, once a year should be fine. If you run short hops and the car doesn't have an opportunity to burn the condensation out of the oil, that's a different issue. His suggestion to me was no more than 12 months due to increasing acidity levels and what this can do to internal parts.
Again, you're going to find opinions all over the spectrum on this stuff. I prefer to stick to the engineering tests performed by indepentent labs.
-G |
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| ardvarkus |
FYI...
http://forums.maxima.org/showthread...threadid=100060
Interesting stuff.
Also gleaned some further info on Z1:
"Lubguard [black] is a ATF friction modifier designed to eliminate
lockup chatter adding it to Dexron type IIIG ATF [Mobil I is this
type] will make the ATF act more like a Honda/Toyota Synthetic
ATF.....resulting in a smoother shift. Just a little is enough and
too much will be hard to get out without a complete 10 quart drain
and starting over."
Ard
PS Anyone up to tracking ATF wear on MDXs???? |
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| DaleB |
quote:
Originally posted by ardvarkus
FYI...
http://forums.maxima.org/showthread...threadid=100060
Interesting stuff.
Also gleaned some further info on Z1:
"Lubguard [black] is a ATF friction modifier designed to eliminate
lockup chatter adding it to Dexron type IIIG ATF [Mobil I is this
type] will make the ATF act more like a Honda/Toyota Synthetic
ATF.....resulting in a smoother shift. Just a little is enough and
too much will be hard to get out without a complete 10 quart drain
and starting over."
Ard
PS Anyone up to tracking ATF wear on MDXs????
Now, let me get this straight. Lubeguard black is to be used in any tranny right?
Lubeguard implies there is an advantage to make the AFT act more like Honda/Toyota Synthetic ATF. ...smoother...
IF Honda or Toyota have synthetic ATFs...a little confusing. Not quite enough information to draw too many conclusions except, there must be something advantageous about using Honda or Toyota ATF...and/or that Lubeguard product.
Maybe if you use Z1, you should not use the Lubeguard product.. too much of a good thing? |
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| presten |
| Many years ago (I hesitate to say how many) when I was a graduate student in Oregon State Automotive Engineering, we did a big test of extended oil change periods for commercial truck fleet and as a control, "normal" drivers in passenger cars. Using extensive oil analysis and many of the standard SAE oil tests we concluded that oil became saturated with micro particles too small to filter long before the oil "wore out". Now I must add that engines in those days generated considerable more "dirt" than a modern engine does but I think that the same considerations apply. I operate a small farm now as well as several cars and as recently as three years ago, did extensive oil analysis on my tractors and cars. The conclusion was about the same....the oil became saturated with solid particles long before any thermal breakdown occurred. When this happens, solids that can not be held in suspension precipitate out in the form of sludge. What I am saying is that IMHO it is far more important to change oil frequently, use a good quality multi-vis oil such as the recommended 5W-30 than to spend gobs of money on very high priced synthetics to try to stretch the oil changes. By all means, if it makes you feel better to buy the synthetics...do it, but don't justify it by pushing the oil change mileage beyond the recommended length. All of the major oils today are head and shoulders above the oils of even 5 years ago and will do the job!! |
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| ardvarkus |
quote:
Originally posted by DaleB
Now, let me get this straight. Lubeguard black is to be used in any tranny right?
Lubeguard implies there is an advantage to make the AFT act more like Honda/Toyota Synthetic ATF. ...smoother...
IF Honda or Toyota have synthetic ATFs...a little confusing. Not quite enough information to draw too many conclusions except, there must be something advantageous about using Honda or Toyota ATF...and/or that Lubeguard product.
Maybe if you use Z1, you should not use the Lubeguard product.. too much of a good thing?
Dale- sorry if I am being confusing:
DO NOT USE ANYTHING OTHER THAT Honda Z1
If you are interested in what is different about Z1, read my post....
There has been much discussion on the ominous phrase "make affect shift quality" when referring to non-Z1 usage in the MDX.
I was pointing out that you can use Lubeguard to modify the characteristics of standard 'dextron type' ATF to make it more like Honda Z1.
This observation tends to support the argument that there is something significantly different about Z1 as compared to other ATF fluids.
Again- no reason to not use Z1.... just a bit more info on who the fluid might be different.
Ard |
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| BaldEagle |
quote:
Originally posted by DaleB
Now, let me get this straight.....
I hate it when my wife starts out with those words.:eek: :2: :rolleyes: |
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| EXCALIBUR |
quote:
Originally posted by presten
What I am saying is that IMHO it is far more important to change oil frequently, use a good quality multi-vis oil such as the recommended 5W-30 than to spend gobs of money on very high priced synthetics to try to stretch the oil changes.
Your post makes very good sense to me. In my case, I do not put very high mileage on my MDX. Much of my driving is in the city on short trips. Therefore, I have decided to change my oil based on 5,000 mile intervals. I will use Chevron Supreme 5w-30, rather than going 7,500 miles with a synthetic oil. But then again, that's me...YMMV. |
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| EXCALIBUR |
quote:
Originally posted by BaldEagle
I hate it when my wife starts out with those words.:eek: :2: :rolleyes:
Q: How do you know when a woman is about to say something intelligent?
A: She begins the sentence with, "A man once told me...."
Sorry ladies, it's only a joke.:D |
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| DaleB |
quote:
Originally posted by BaldEagle
I hate it when my wife starts out with those words.:eek: :2: :rolleyes:
So do I ! This is my one chance to use it. I wouldn't dare use it at home!
ard,
Thanks for the 'clarify' . I do use the standard Lubetech as an additive, the red stuff which is supposed to increase temp. protection, otherwise nothing but Z1. |
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| inky |
anyone seen this oil. from the mobil one web site
Mobil 1 with SuperSynTM 0W-20 is engineered specifically for Ford, Honda and any other vehicle where a 0W-20 or 5W-20 engine oil is recommended. Mobil 1 with SuperSynTM 0W-20 exceeds API SL/CF, ILSAC GF-3, and the performance requirements Ford WSS-M2C-153H specification. This full synthetic formulation provides both exceptional engine protection while providing more efficient operation as indicated by improved fuel economy or greater power when compared to more viscous products |
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| DaleB |
quote:
Originally posted by inky
anyone seen this oil. from the mobil one web site
Mobil 1 with SuperSynTM 0W-20 is engineered specifically for Ford, Honda and any other vehicle where a 0W-20 or 5W-20 engine oil is recommended. Mobil 1 with SuperSynTM 0W-20 exceeds API SL/CF, ILSAC GF-3, and the performance requirements Ford WSS-M2C-153H specification. This full synthetic formulation provides both exceptional engine protection while providing more efficient operation as indicated by improved fuel economy or greater power when compared to more viscous products
Probably a very fine product. But notice, just like generic ATF (synthetic or not), they never quote the actual Honda specification that they meet. |
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| mdxxxx |
quote:
Originally posted by BaldEagle
I hate it when my wife starts out with those words.:eek: :2: :rolleyes:
You too BaldEagle!? Oh man, I thought I was the only one who felt that way! LOL!:D |
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| ardvarkus |
quote:
Originally posted by DaleB
Probably a very fine product. But notice, just like generic ATF (synthetic or not), they never quote the actual Honda specification that they meet.
Dale- Interesting point...I've actually never seen Honda put out a specification on their Z1. I've seen a few mfgs that claim their product is 'equivalent' but no spec.
Without a spec, there's no way to 'officially' match it. One company claims it is equivalent, yet no way to verify....
Ard |
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