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Consumer's Report loved the MDX, but said the emergency handling was poor because of a fishtailing problem. I just saw it.
I was on the fwy today with my 1 day old (or new) MB MDX when another one passed me going around 90 mph. Ahead of me he hit his brakes and attempted to change lanes to avoid plowing into a slower driver in his lane. His car then fishtailed violently about 6 times, just missing the center guard rail and adjacent lane. I could see the frame and body flex, then a chrome colored rod the width of the car fell out from the bottom of his MDX. He kept on driving, probably with wet pants!
Has anyone experienced this problem? |
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| he does not know the limitations of his vehicle and driving skills. He could have been driving an NSX and if he did not know these 2 important things he would probably fishtailed also but maybe a little less due to the lower center of gravity. Even traction control or something similar will not save you if you past your vehicles limits and your own driving skills. I think everybody would probably agree to that. |
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I don't think you need stability control at that point - you need idiot insurance.
I can't think of a single ESC system that would compensate for an emergency maneuver at 90 MPH on a 4400LB vehicle. It would be pretty sweet if possible though. Next on the agenda would be autopilot.
CR's reviews were more realistic - the lack of stability control with respect to slower speeds and turns. People have remarked in other threads that the MDX's type of AWD prevents such a system from being implementable. Don't know if that's true though. |
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Something fell out from under the car?
Maybe a suspension component failure, contributing to the handling behavior? Or maybe just something in the road that he kicked up? Considering that we have unpainted iron castings under there, it doesn't seem likely that anything chromed would have come from the MDX. What did it seem like to you?
I have tested the high speed stopping capabilities of this vehicle and also thought that it may get a little light in the butt. A bit of suspension / ABS tuning may be needed in a future model. |
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I'm reading this differently... that driver's experience, although scary and not real bright, sounds pretty positive. High speed maneuvering, losing the rear end and keeping the 4 wheels on the road without incident (other than scaring the s**t out of the people around him) is a pretty compelling argument for the abilities of the MDX.
Not that I'm going to go out and test the limits any time soon, it's still good to hear that our vehicle can pretty much stay put in emergency handling.
That must have been phenomenal to see.
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quote:
Originally posted by ScottyB
I'm reading this differently... that driver's experience, although scary and not real bright, sounds pretty positive. High speed maneuvering, losing the rear end and keeping the 4 wheels on the road without incident (other than scaring the s**t out of the people around him) is a pretty compelling argument for the abilities of the MDX.
Sadly, very, very few people are trained or skilled to properly handle a situation like that. The fact that this obvious moron, with limitted experience with the MDX (how long could he have owned it!) was able to maintain control is a tribute to its handling.
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| At least the MDX did not get the dreaded "not acceptable" rating, which CR just slapped on the Montero. |
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quote:
Originally posted by A2MDXer
At least the MDX did not get the dreaded "not acceptable" rating, which CR just slapped on the Montero.
To add to the above poster:
http://cnnfn.cnn.com/2001/06/20/home_auto/autos_cu/
This is a CNN financial article, I was unable to quickly find a link to an actual CR article.
It would have been one of my other choices if MDX had not turned up.
12 pm. OK, a video on CNN
http://www.cnn.com/video/us/2001/06...r.affl.med.html
Scary!
I am sure this is the part of the same test which also involved the MDX. I wonder if there is a way to obtain the MDX video. |
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quote:
Originally posted by vip9
12 pm. OK, a video on CNN
http://www.cnn.com/video/us/2001/06...r.affl.med.html
Scary!
I am sure this is the part of the same test which also involved the MDX. I wonder if there is a way to obtain the MDX video.
WOW! Scary is right vip... and that's at a relatively low speed. You see that right front tire blowout on the silver one. Yikes!
I would love to see all the other SUV's they tested. I guess Mitsu is trying to save face by claiming the test isn't real world... low speed, a car pulls out in front of you, you cut the wheel to avoid it. What's not real world about that? |
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quote:
Originally posted by H2ODavid
I could see the frame and body flex, then a chrome colored rod the width of the car fell out from the bottom of his MDX. He kept on driving, probably with wet pants!
Has anyone experienced this problem?
Maybe the chrome rod that fell out cured his "thud" problem? |
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This was a Ford Explorer? It probably would have tipped over. If someone is going that fast, slams on the brakes to avoid an accident, my opionion was very lucky he didn't wreck. He sounds like he needs a lesson in driving.
Lmeans
P.S. I should put he or she. It doesn't have to be a man driver to be an idiot.
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| Just out of curiousity, is the crazy driver on this forum and willing to give us the blow by blow details?;) |
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It would handle the 90mph lane change. Just give me one to show you with and I promise I'll give yo uthe keys back after I prove it works :-)
Actually, I don't think the NSX even has VSA yet. It'd probably spin out if an inexperienced driver stomps the brakes and then spins the steering wheel hard... ;-)
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| I just meant that even with a great sports car that is meant for some spirited driving, even the latest technology can not save you from yourself when you go beyond your limits or should I say stupidity or ignorance. |
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"I don't think you need stability control at that point - you need idiot insurance."
Does AcuraCare cover Idiot Insurance? |
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quote:
Originally posted by bdespain
Just out of curiousity, is the crazy driver on this forum and willing to give us the blow by blow details?;)
Even if the driver is a forum member, I don't think he/she will ever step forward. Not with all the derogatory remarks thrown at him/her!
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quote:
Originally posted by H2ODavid
Consumer's Report loved the MDX, but said the emergency handling was poor because of a fishtailing problem. I just saw it.
Pardon the interruption, but just to clarify, Consumer Reports did NOT say that the MDX's emergency handling was "poor." They said it was "fair" (the half-black dot). "Poor" is the solid black dot. |
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Fair or poor, or whatever rating is there - what's the difference to those who already drive MDX? Of course, the ~4.5k lbs truck cannot handle in emergency as good as a sedan - it does require getting used to, changing the driving habbits, decreasing the speed limits (90 mph on a busy freeway - sh1t for brains 100%). Think 5 times before rushing in it somewhere, jumping from lane to lane, going fast on curves, etc... (done that - thank god, breaks on a dry pavement work GREAT!)
After reading Vip9's comments about his winter driving experiences, I am getting a bit concerned about braking and handling on wet, icy and snowy surfaces. VTM will get you out, but it won't help you to halt fast! Instead of watching pros trying to tip over the trucks at 40 mph, I'd rather see how the trucks handle emergency braking on wet asphalt, ice and snow... |
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quote:
Originally posted by sgtglok
Instead of watching pros trying to tip over the trucks at 40 mph, I'd rather see how the trucks handle emergency braking on wet asphalt, ice and snow...
Have to agree on this, 100%. I'm in Miami and the rainy season (hopefully) should be hitting us. Miami drivers suck to begin with, when there's a little water on the ground, forget it!
Just yesterday I started looking for a driving school to take a 1 or 2 day class that has SUV's. I only found a few places, BMW being one of them. Having a realistic understanding of how this type of vehicle will handle in an emergency situation is suddenly high on my list. I would love to find a place that will let you use your own vehicle with outriggers on skid pad tests. Not that I want to blow a tire or damage my bute, but I would like to get a feel for MY MDX. |
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Sarge, you are alive!!! :) I thought you were so much in love with your GiGi babe (or, so much disappointed) that you vanished from the face of this forum. :D Nice to see you are back!
Anyway, not to get on Crem's troll list or on Remery and Co. bad side, I really want to stress that my "poor winter handling" comments are meant to be read in context of comparing MDX to Subaru based on my experience and opinion. I am sure that MDX's winter handling is 10x or even 100x better than that of Corvette or Porshe. :)
MDX being at least 1000 lbs heavier than Subaru and MUCH higher off the ground (in Subaru, I sometimes had a feeling that my butt is about to scrape the pavement ;)) certainly works against "better" handling.
If you survived numerous NY winters in your previous cars, you will DEFINITELY survive them in the MDX, unless you decide to test its limits. |
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quote:
Originally posted by ScottyB
...Having a realistic understanding of how this type of vehicle will handle in an emergency situation is suddenly high on my list. I would love to find a place that will let you use your own vehicle with outriggers on skid pad tests. Not that I want to blow a tire or damage my bute, but I would like to get a feel for MY MDX.
Sometime at the end of last year either still on Edmunds, or early on this forum, there was a discussion about a course somewhere in Pa, where I believe MotorTrend was testing MDX, X5, etc (and MDX came on top!). Someone said that the course is occasionally open to the public.
I would not venture into testing the limits of MY car on such a track, but I certainly did some "emergency" handling maneuver testing on empty streets and parking lots. I would not let my family into the car before I know how much I can "trust" it. |
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quote:
Originally posted by vip9
I would not venture into testing the limits of MY car on such a track, but I certainly did some "emergency" handling maneuver testing on empty streets and parking lots. I would not let my family into the car before I know how much I can "trust" it.
I've done some minor testing, brakes reaction, checking body roll, changing lanes, but nothing on wet stuff. And that's one of my big concerns. Say, 40mph hitting 'em and lets see how she steers. I'm reluctant to test that without protection for the vehicle, or on a closed track. I drive pretty sedate these days, but you still can't control those around you. There's no way in I'm going to "test" an emergency situation at 75, and pray I never have to! Yet that's the speed I drive every day to work and back. |
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I had some experience (planned and unplanned)stopping on ice during my April trip through the west. Fortunately I was always able to stop in time and on the road, but a few times the process involved varying degrees of sphincter tightening excitement.
Sgtglok is absolutely right - VTM can get you going and keep you going - it doesn't do much about helping you stop. In fact, depending on conditions, not much beyond the grace of God and clean living will stop you - except having enough road and time (and/or chains and studs). ABS is swell IF there is enough traction for the brakes to do significant work. On pure glaze ice, all the ABS will do is constantly release the brakes, rapidly switching you from tire skid to rolling - neither of which can really do a lot about STOPPING you. The ABS does help keep you going in a straight line but under worst-case frictionless conditions, your stopping distance is going to be approximately the same as if you stopped by coasting and never touched the brakes. Try that sometime and you'll find stopping distance tends to be measured in counties not feet. Fortunately, there will usually be SOME traction, loose snow, sand, roughness of the ice so you'll stop somewhat quicker. The bad news is there is no good way to know how well you'll stop on ice except by doing it. So keep your speed down and allow LOTS of room.
This is not just about the MDX, it applies to any vehicle. Just remember that the MDX is BIG and HEAVY which means MORE MASS which means greater distance. |
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No doubt that a moron shouldn't push a two ton vehicle too hard, regardless of the technology on it.
Nevertheless, there are other SUV's that have better emergency handling than the MDX (don't fishtail as much in an avoidance situation). The difference between "poor" and "fair" in CR's estimate is that poor means outright spinning around vs. fishtailing. For the former, they will not recommend the vehicle at all (e.g. the Toyota Land Cruiser before Toyota added VSC to it, where it now stands as fair).
Obviously if the conditions are severe enough, there may be no difference between poor and fair, but wouldn't you rather have the better capability if it's available to you?
There is a diminishing return factor here, made more complicated by the fact that there's no absolutes here. And if one drives sensibly, the odds of running into such a severe situation go down dramatically. But that doesn't mean that Acura can't improve the emergency handling.
I don't agree with the "it's not a sports sedan, it's an SUV" idea in the sense that yes, it's not a sports sedan and won't ever be a sports sedan, but it doesn't mean it has to be as pedestrian in its emergency handling as an Explorer. Acura sells the vehicle as being a marked improvement on other SUV's, and they should get the emergency handling at least on the par of an RX300 and ML320. If we waved the white flag when it came to improving performance and handling characteristics of an SUV, we wouldn't have the MDX in the first place. |
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well, i know for a fact, that most drivers do not use the lower gears when the weather conditions change - i mean it takes some serious manual reading to navigate through that shift-box maze! :D
any "pro" comments on the use? also, did anybody attempt to shift gears on the move? i guess i'd have to seat and read that blasted manual myself... one day! ;)
also, i wonder if michelins offer better handling/traction on wet/ice... GYs are ok on straight roads, but scream for help when i tend to be a little abusive on the corners! |
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| I have more time with the Michelins than the Goodyears but my impression is that the more aggressive Michelin tread does indeed help in mud, ice, snow and other unpleasantness. I have not experienced any untoward noise or control problems even with fairly aggressive cornering. |
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| I've driven the MDX in the snow and poorly plowed roads of NJ without ever having a problem or a moment of insecurity. In fact, the MDX handles better than the Isuzu Rodeo the MDX replaced. And the Isuzu had a traditional four wheel drive system with differential locks and a low setting on the transfer case. IMHO, if there are winter conditions so severe the MDX can't handle them than you should think twice about driving in them with any vehicle. |
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Hi all,
I've been away from this forum for a bit too long, and I think this is the right time to chime in again. For those of you who had their heads buried in the sand the past several weeks, Houston was hit recently by tropical storm Allison. It turns out that Allison is already the costliest tropical storm in history, with a damage total that has exceeded $4Billion (and still counting). During this time, we experienced rains that had to be considered torrential (by any definition of the word). The area where we live was relatively "spared", receiving just nearly 20 inches of rain in just over 72 hours.
On my way home the first day of the deluge, I was caught in an unbelievable downpour (estimated at a rainfall rate of >5 inches/hour). I learned how to drive in Minnesota, and I've driven in heavy blizzards, sleet and freezing rain before. This, however, was something for the books.
The punchline is that I felt incredibly comfortable in the MDX. No, I wasn't speeding along at 75 mph in rain so dense that it was difficult to see foreward in late-afternoon light. But I wasn't moving at a crawl, either, and I never felt any sensation of slip or hydroplaning. The wipers worked beautifully, the headlights were fine (OEM, no Razo bulbs needed) and I felt confident that I was in complete control.
I realize that this anecdote doesn't prove that the MDX is perfect. I (like wmquan) went from driving an Integra GS-R to an SUV for the first time when we bought the MDX. Anyone with a basic knowledge of physics and a grain of common sense should realize that an MDX should not be driven like a sports car, given differences in mass and center of gravity.
All in all, my experience has made me feel more comfortable. Given that I'll likely never see rain that intense again, I'm confident that we'll be safe in our MDX. |
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vehicle...strange that such a highly credible magazine would make such a mistake. Oh well, the report was very favorable on the MDX. In fact, CR said it was one of the highest scoring of all the SUV's they've tested. Also, at 4500 pounds, the MDX had the highest towing capacity of the four vehicles tested in the report. They did state that they would like to electronic stability contronl on the MDX.
Now, one safety aspect that I have been very pleased with is the lack of hydroplaning in heavy rain. The MDX is rock solid in heavy rain...too my surprise as I have experienced hydoplanning in a lot of vehicles. I hope I never have to push the MDX to its corning limits; therefore, I will never see the fishtailing the CR report faults the MDX on.
Regards |
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quote:
Originally posted by GaTadpole777
[B]vehicle...strange that such a highly credible magazine would make such a mistake.
I don't think CR made any mistake in this matter.
Foxbat |
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By virtually every definition I have seen it is AWD.
quote:
Originally posted by GaTadpole777
vehicle...strange that such a highly credible magazine would make such a mistake. O
Regards
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quote:
Originally posted by mogur
By virtually every definition I have seen it is AWD.
quote:
Originally posted by GaTadpole777
vehicle...strange that such a highly credible magazine would make such a mistake. O
Regards
4 wheel drive means that there is a low range. The MDX doesn't have this so it is all wheel drive. Consumer Reports didn't make a mistake.
As for hydroplaning, I attribute that to the good tires and nothing more. |
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According to automotive authority Eliot Lim:
"It is important to get the definitions down first, since for any four wheeled vehicle, all wheel drive and four wheel drive literally mean the same thing. Generally speaking "all wheel drive" implies permanently engaged or automatically engaging four wheel drive and "four wheel drive" implies manually engaging, part time four wheel drive. The auto industry usually abide by these definitions but not in all cases. The now departed "all wheel drive" Ford Tempo and Subaru Justy were really part time manually engaging systems, like the older Subaru GLs. The term on demand four wheel drive is quite ambiguous. It can either mean that it is a part time manually engaging system or a part time automatically engaging system!
The automotive media shares a lot of the responsibility for the confusion. Factual errors are common, so is the careless use of the various terms interchangebly."
So you pays your money and takes your choice.
Meep Meep
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I don't mean to be defensive, but if the MDX is AWD why is that fact not mentioned ANYWHERE in the MDX literature? The big brochure that my dealer gave me states many times about the MDX having 4-wheel drive, i. e., inside cover, section 11 Control...Acura states "The computer-controlled 4-wheel drive system of the MDX expands on the traction benefits of a front-wheel drive layout by redirecting torque to the rear wheels, as needed. So the MDX can operate efficiently as possible while offering 4-wheel drive maneuverability and acceleration."
From everything I can read it appears we have front wheel drive, NOT all wheel drive, but when we have slippage the VTM applies drive torque to the rear wheel as needed.
Now, folks, I am no expert, and I have yet to believe I have received an expert answer...just some saying we have AWD. Yes, it is confusing but don't you think from a marketing standpoint that ACURA would have used the term All Wheel Drive if that, indeed, is what we have? I think an AWD vehile would have produced even more interest in the MDX, if that is possible, and raised the bar for the competition.
No matter 4wheel drive or AWD, I still love the MDX. I would like an Acura representative to clarify the issue of 4wheel drive versus AWD. Maybe someone can give a more definitive answer than those who think we have AWD in the MDX. If we have AWD, then Acura should call it that in its brochures, and stop calling it 4 wheel drive.
I would like to believe folks when they just state we have AWD in the MDX; but until Acura or a technical expert explains it differently than what ACURA states in their own slaes brochure, I say we have a 4-wheel drive vehicle...and a darn good one at that.
Regards
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quote:
Originally posted by GaTadpole777
No matter 4wheel drive or AWD, I still love the MDX.
that should be the end of it!... those that drive MDX - what do you care what cr or the others have to say about it? it's informationals for those looking to buy from those being paid to sell... no matter what others tell you what's important is that YOU know your vehicle's handling & limitations; please, stop the madness!!! |
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However, Car and Driver in awarding it the BEST SUV explains that the MDX is a 4-wheel drive vehicle...folks need to know what they really own.
This ends this issue for me as I know that I own a 4-wheel drive vehicle. For those that want to believe they have an AWD MDX, that is okay by me...let us all enjoy our wonderful MDXs.
For more info on 4wheel vs. AWD, please read the Car and Driver Report @ http://www.caranddriver.com/xp/Cara...st_acuramdx.xml
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I think Elliot Lim's explanation, as posted by Road Runner, explains the confusion pretty well.
I consider the MDX to be AWD because it requires no interaction on the part of the driver to engage. The fact that it performs as a FWD in steady conditions is more a factor of how Honda's engineers programmed the system to work. My current car is AWD, with a viscous coupling. During normal driving, 95% is aportioned to the front wheels. My wife's old car was an AWD Rav4, which also used a VC set up to perform like a FWD in normal conditions.
Any slippage, and the VC sends more torque to the rear wheels.
From the driver's seat, it's totally seamless, and even though it's a different system (i.e. not a VC, not a Torsen, not really "center differential" at all), I expect the MDX will be the same. |
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quote:
Originally posted by golfski
I think Elliot Lim's explanation, as posted by Road Runner, explains the confusion pretty well.
I consider the MDX to be AWD because it requires no interaction on the part of the driver to engage. The fact that it performs as a FWD in steady conditions is more a factor of how Honda's engineers programmed the system to work. My current car is AWD, with a viscous coupling. During normal driving, 95% is aportioned to the front wheels. My wife's old car was an AWD Rav4, which also used a VC set up to perform like a FWD in normal conditions.
Any slippage, and the VC sends more torque to the rear wheels.
From the driver's seat, it's totally seamless, and even though it's a different system (i.e. not a VC, not a Torsen, not really "center differential" at all), I expect the MDX will be the same.
The RAV4 has a 50/50 split in normal conditions. It's not FWD until slippage like the CR-V. Unfortunately the 4WD and AWD terms have been all mixed up due to different manufacturers and magazines calling them different things. |
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I believe 4 wheel drive is most commonly used to describe a vehicle with a low and high gear range, whereas AWD is used to describe a vehicle with high range only, like the MDX. Either can be full time or part time, depending on whether there is a center differential or not, but I can't think of any part time AWD's off the top of my head. Jeep Wranglers are the classic example of part time 4 wheel drive.
The VTM4 is too unique to fit neatly into any existing niche, but calling it AWD is close enough. Read Car and Driver's off road test for proof of its real world effectiveness. |
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Speaking of road tests, if you haven't read the MDX profile
by James Healey for USA Today, please do so. His description of the winter traction competition among SUVs
will warm your heart. The "whuppin" MDX administers to the
big-time pretenders leaves no doubt who the champ is!
Check it out... http://www.usatoday.com/money/columns/healey/0029.htm
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another automotive expert states our MDXs are really 4-wheel dirve vehicles...that is okay with me.
I can see how folks feel they are all wheel drive as the MDX automatically moves into 4-wheel drive as needed.
Now, if I could just fix my weeping mirrors...
Regards |
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Please make that 4 wheel DRIVE...sorry for the typo.
Regards |
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I have a hunch that the "marketing types" coined the AWD moniker a few years back to avoid having the 4WD stigma put on their newer-generation vehicles. Maybe they figured that if grandma associated "FOUR-WHEEL-DRIVE" with a car, she might discount it as one which she might own?
Anyway, who cares. |
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Healey forgets to mention the test he is referring to was performed by Honda using a prototype MDX. (not sure why a reporter would do this) The demonstration was part of a marketing show by Honda before the MDX was available for sale. Not exactly an unbiased test.
quote:
Originally posted by CIC53
Speaking of road tests, if you haven't read the MDX profile
by James Healey for USA Today, please do so. His description of the winter traction competition among SUVs
will warm your heart. The "whuppin" MDX administers to the
big-time pretenders leaves no doubt who the champ is!
Check it out... http://www.usatoday.com/money/columns/healey/0029.htm
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quote:
Originally posted by zzdawg
Healey forgets to mention the test he is referring to was performed by Honda using a prototype MDX. (not sure why a reporter would do this) The demonstration was part of a marketing show by Honda before the MDX was available for sale. Not exactly an unbiased test.
No, not exactly an unbiased test, but it is the reporter's point of view, not Honda's.
I don't know if the vehicle used in the test would be considered a "prototype". It is more likely a pre-production vehicle with no significant differences to the production product (other than maybe a few final tweaks in the production model). |
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| Mike Williams |
quote:
Originally posted by H2ODavid
Consumer's Report loved the MDX, but said the emergency handling was poor because of a fishtailing problem. I just saw it.
I was on the fwy today with my 1 day old (or new) MB MDX when another one passed me going around 90 mph. Ahead of me he hit his brakes and attempted to change lanes to avoid plowing into a slower driver in his lane. His car then fishtailed violently about 6 times, just missing the center guard rail and adjacent lane. I could see the frame and body flex, then a chrome colored rod the width of the car fell out from the bottom of his MDX. He kept on driving, probably with wet pants!
Has anyone experienced this problem?
Yes....My 2003 MDX has hydroplaned on me 3 times from Dec. to June, which was the the one that took the cake! It is still in the shop with over $12k in damage after hydroplaning on the interstate going 65 in rain. I have called and complained but no answers. I am a very good driver but the MDX does not like water!!! The second time it did it a car came in my lane and to avoid getting hit i turned the wheel slightly which caused the vehicle to slam a curb and tear up 2 tires...Acura would not replace anything! Mine is a real piece of...well you can guess!! I have owned over 4 different SUV's and none have ever done this before...You gotta love a $30K something vehicle which does not respond to water well!!! |
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| 04mdx4sq |
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Williams
Yes....My 2003 MDX has hydroplaned on me 3 times from Dec. to June, which was the the one that took the cake! It is still in the shop with over $12k in damage after hydroplaning on the interstate going 65 in rain.
I believe there is a limit to what you should expect a vehicle assistance system to do. I have repeatedly pushed the vehicle to see what it does under adverse conditions, not only in rain but in snow/ ice and have found it to be quite stable under nearly all circumstances. The problems seem to come when driver reactions counteract what the stability assist is doing, this seems to disrupt the balance. I have gotten the vehicle to hydroplane several times and as long as I don't try to outsmart the system, it stays in control better than any other vehicle I have owned. When you try to counter the stability assist, you can definitely get things out of whack in a hurry. |
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| Paclark01 |
It is obvious that this is driver error. I have driven in monsoon rain in Florida on I-4 at 55 to 65 mph, and as a current Maryland resident we receive odd weather from time to time. I must say that the MDX is definitely a sure-footed and stable SUV in all of the adverse weather conditions I have personally experienced.
Keep in the mind that the driver dictates the automobile, not the other way around. |
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| anjan |
I have to chime in on this one. Because of the type of driver I am, I usually push the vehicle in little increments to realize the limits of control. Every vehicle has a gamut of control. For example, the MDX starts to lose control in icy conditions if you accelerate on a curve. And that is the only time I've seen a slight indication of the stability control starting to lose.
This is the best vehicle I've driven in rain, without a doubt. Some of the older roads around my neighborhood don't have good drainage and collects water like crazy in moderate to heavy rain. The MDX has never even flinched going around 45 or so through upto 3 inches of water. Of course, you can feel that its trying to keep up to the conditions and does an admirable job. Now, if I were to swerve in that condition, I'm sure I'll have a mangled heap of metal around me... |
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| markn |
| This is for Mike Williams. Just out of curiosity what tires are on your MDX and what is the mileage on them?? |
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| XStatic |
quote:
Originally posted by GaTadpole777
Consumer's Report calls the MDX an AWD vehicle when it is actually a 4-wheel drive
vehicle...strange that such a highly credible magazine would make such a mistake.
Regards
What?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4_wheel_drive
Four wheel drive (4WD or 4x4 for short) was the original term, often used to describe truck-like vehicles that required the driver to manually switch between a two wheel drive mode for streets and a four wheel drive mode for low traction conditions such as ice, mud, or loose gravel. The "all wheel drive" term (AWD for short) was invented to distinguish vehicles that are capable of driving all four wheels on normal roads without causing poor control and excessive tire and drivetrain wear. Most modern AWD vehicles do not continuously drive all four wheels, but instead switch from two wheel drive to four wheel drive automatically as needed.
MDX is AWD! |
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| XStatic |
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Williams
Yes....My 2003 MDX has hydroplaned on me 3 times from Dec. to June
I am a very good driver but the MDX does not like water!!!
It is hard to not be sound harsh here...
Perhaps the MDX doesn't like water, perhaps it doesn't like the specific conditions you have presented, tires, wear, speed, temperature, road surface, water depth, etc.
In any case it seems a bit of a stretch to proclaim being a good driver when you still have not learned the characteristics of the vehicle you are driving.
A couple hints:
1) When you drive a new car in a circumstance you have not driven that car in before. Be cautious as you learn what the car can and can not do.
2) When you do learn by example what the vehicle is not capable of, try not to present those same conditions again. The vehicle will likely perform in the same undesirable manor. |
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| JL_SS |
quote:
Originally posted by XStatic
What?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4_wheel_drive
Four wheel drive (4WD or 4x4 for short) was the original term, often used to describe truck-like vehicles that required the driver to manually switch between a two wheel drive mode for streets and a four wheel drive mode for low traction conditions such as ice, mud, or loose gravel. The "all wheel drive" term (AWD for short) was invented to distinguish vehicles that are capable of driving all four wheels on normal roads without causing poor control and excessive tire and drivetrain wear. Most modern AWD vehicles do not continuously drive all four wheels, but instead switch from two wheel drive to four wheel drive automatically as needed.
MDX is AWD!
That message you are responding to was posted in 2001............ |
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| Mike Williams |
quote:
Originally posted by markn
This is for Mike Williams. Just out of curiosity what tires are on your MDX and what is the mileage on them??
My MDX has 45,670 miles on it and the tires are Michelin Cross Country Radial X 103T's...I bought the vehicle last summer, used with 29,000 miles on it. The tires were new when I purchased the vehicle so basically 16,000 miles on them now. |
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| Mike Williams |
quote:
Originally posted by XStatic
It is hard to not be sound harsh here...
Perhaps the MDX doesn't like water, perhaps it doesn't like the specific conditions you have presented, tires, wear, speed, temperature, road surface, water depth, etc.
In any case it seems a bit of a stretch to proclaim being a good driver when you still have not learned the characteristics of the vehicle you are driving.
A couple hints:
1) When you drive a new car in a circumstance you have not driven that car in before. Be cautious as you learn what the car can and can not do.
2) When you do learn by example what the vehicle is not capable of, try not to present those same conditions again. The vehicle will likely perform in the same undesirable manor.
I understand what your saying, but this vehicle will just come out from under me without warning on wet pavement. But....I have passed transfer trucks in a driving rain and it does not have a problem at all. The first time it did it was in Dec. and I was going staight, no curves and it did it 2 times within 20 minutes on a trip. The last time (June), we were going staight and all of a sudden the rear end came out from under me and the front end headed left into the fast lane and started to do 360's until it ran off the interstate into the cable system and went about 200' backwards clipping all but 4 post and ended up sitting in one with the rear right tire between 2 cables. I never touched the breaks or tried to correct the steering. No warning, just poof no traction and into a spin and off the road we went. Oh..and $13k in damages including a bent frame. |
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| ScoobyT |
2 Mike Williams
Perhaps your car is possessed? Or a Democrat - "the front end headed left" ? In any case, maybe it`s time to attend a driver safety course of some kind? |
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| Mike Williams |
quote:
Originally posted by ScoobyT
2 Mike Williams
Perhaps your car is possessed? Or a Democrat - "the front end headed left" ? In any case, maybe it`s time to attend a driver safety course of some kind?
How about opening your eyes and read what I write! I don't need any freeking driving lessons as I am 51 and have owned quite a few SUV's over the years and not one of them has ever hydroplaned on me. This vehicle is a piece of ****! Or I could be nice a say it's a LEMON!!! |
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| Mike Williams |
quote:
Originally posted by Paclark01
It is obvious that this is driver error. I have driven in monsoon rain in Florida on I-4 at 55 to 65 mph, and as a current Maryland resident we receive odd weather from time to time. I must say that the MDX is definitely a sure-footed and stable SUV in all of the adverse weather conditions I have personally experienced.
Keep in the mind that the driver dictates the automobile, not the other way around.
You haven't a clue about this MDX!! I did not just fall off the turnip truck!!! It's a piece of crap when it comes to wet pavement and it's not the tires or my driving...... when it comes out from under me going straight down the Interstate!! Maybe yours is fine but mine is black and should be painted YELLOW!!! |
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| wmquan |
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Williams
... the tires are Michelin Cross Country Radial X 103T's...
I'm a bit confused ... I can't find Cross Country Radial tires on Michelin's web site. Do you mean Cross Terrain?
I know that Uniroyal makes a Cross Country tired, but obviously they're not Michelin. |
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| DaleB |
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Williams
You haven't a clue about this MDX!! I did not just fall off the turnip truck!!! It's a piece of crap when it comes to wet pavement and it's not the tires or my driving...... when it comes out from under me going straight down the Interstate!! Maybe yours is fine but mine is black and should be painted YELLOW!!!
The major reason you are getting the responses you do:
If you look up 10 of thousands of posts, complaints about hydroplaning are only a few in the 5 years this forum has been active.
Where praises for good handling helping owners get out of dangerous situations are many times that number.
Neither do any published car reviews support it.
Agreed, that does not mean your are not having a problem with your MDX. |
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| Mike Williams |
quote:
Originally posted by wmquan
I'm a bit confused ... I can't find Cross Country Radial tires on Michelin's web site. Do you mean Cross Terrain?
I know that Uniroyal makes a Cross Country tired, but obviously they're not Michelin.
Yes, I typed to fast...They are cross terrain.. |
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| Mike Williams |
quote:
Originally posted by DaleB
The major reason you are getting the responses you do:
If you look up 10 of thousands of posts, complaints about hydroplaning are only a few in the 5 years this forum has been active.
Where praises for good handling helping owners get out of dangerous situations are many times that number.
Neither do any published car reviews support it.
Agreed, that does not mean your are not having a problem with your MDX.
Thanks for what you said!! Their is always a bad apple even though most are good....My MDX was towed behind a motor home for most of the first 29,000 miles without a car dolly before I bought it. No one seems to have an answer at Acura, but mine has been a real pain in the tush!! Their is no warning and it feels just like when you slip on a sheet of ice with your feet and you fall flat on your ass and have no control until you fall... |
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| DaleB |
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Williams
Thanks for what you said!! Their is always a bad apple even though most are good....My MDX was towed behind a motor home for most of the first 29,000 miles without a car dolly before I bought it. No one seems to have an answer at Acura, but mine has been a real pain in the tush!! Their is no warning and it feels just like when you slip on a sheet of ice with your feet and you fall flat on your ass and have no control until you fall...
My time in a motor vehicle I did not feel totally safe in would be very short, at best. Wish I could offer some better, or more specific advice.
When I was in the Air Force I had a '67 VW bug that would do 180's on ice with a strong enough wind. Barring anyone coming in your path, it was considered fun. An AF buddy called it 'highway ballet'.
Of course, these conditions were standard in a bug, they should not exist in an SUV.
:( |
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| pianoman41 |
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Williams
It's a piece of crap when it comes to wet pavement and it's not the tires or my driving...... when it comes out from under me going straight down the Interstate!!
Tires are *absolutely* involved in hydroplaning since they are the only part of the vehicle that actually touch the water. If you're going straight down the interstate and the vehicle comes out from under you, then you are either (a) going way too fast for conditions, or (b) the tires are not adequately moving the water.
Now you could have an alignment or camber problem that could make the steering twitchy at interstate speeds, but that would also manifest itself on dry pavement as well. |
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| frainc |
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Williams
How about opening your eyes and read what I write! I don't need any freeking driving lessons as I am 51 and have owned quite a few SUV's over the years and not one of them has ever hydroplaned on me. This vehicle is a piece of ****! Or I could be nice a say it's a LEMON!!!
This is by far the best in wet weather for me. I never have a problem as stated by you. Has to be something with your alignment
because no one here has that kind of problem with just normal driving. |
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| 04mdx4sq |
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Williams
How about opening your eyes and read what I write! I don't need any freeking driving lessons as I am 51 and have owned quite a few SUV's over the years and not one of them has ever hydroplaned on me. This vehicle is a piece of ****! Or I could be nice a say it's a LEMON!!!
Mike, we are all sorry that you and your superb driving skills have been saddled with the pos MDX. |
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| ardvarkus |
Wierd one...
I'm still trying to evaluate my MDX- only driven it 105,780 miles to date. Still not sure if that hydroplaning issue will pop up..
WHile there may be something wrong with Mikes MDX or his tires or his frame or his alignment or his VTM4 controller or something relatyed to being towed for 29k miles and frying the vtm clutches.... whatever... there is no systemic MDX hydroplaning issue.
Mike, ask about how to fix the issue with your car- but there is no problem endemic to the MDX.
I could imagine a situation where a faulty vtm system could create a loss of control... possible, but unlikely that it would pass all self tests but respond inappropriately in certain sitautions.. just a WAG
A |
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| DaleB |
What about traction control? Is there a tendency for it to act 'funny' with TC on or off? Faulty ABS wheel sensor?
If you have not yet, Mike. I would consider taking it into a independent chassis/alignment shop and have it evaluated also.
If they do find something defective, a documented report to Acura should get anything fixed that's still under warranty.
Of course, Acura would have to agree do the repair. |
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| Paclark01 |
From my understanding of vehicles that have been towed behind motorhomes without a dolly... I am under the impression that all-wheel drive vehicles should not be towed with all four wheels on the ground or with a dolly. A full auto transport with all four wheels off the ground is required. I towed my MDX from Florida to Maryland on an auto transport behind a moving van since I was informed by the dealer that the drivetrain would go to crap if I was to tow the MDX on a two-wheeled dolly.
In Mikes case I would definitely follow the recommendation of a trip to a body shop to check for possible frame damage, and alignment issues. You MDX has either been in a bad accident where the repairs were subpar, or poor vehicle maintenance could be a possibility.
It doesn't have anything to do with the design, or build of the MDX. There are other issues that need to be investigated. |
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| XStatic |
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Williams
You haven't a clue about this MDX!! I did not just fall off the turnip truck!!! It's a piece of crap when it comes to wet pavement and it's not the tires or my driving...... when it comes out from under me going straight down the Interstate!! Maybe yours is fine but mine is black and should be painted YELLOW!!!
Thanks for the nice reply to my post, it seems to have gone downhill from there though.
If what you say is true and you are driving correctly then you really need to get the car checked out because it should not behave like that and I don't recall anyone else having that experience.
I can assure you that my 2003 doesn't anyway.
The only time I have experienced what you describe is when I was riding with a driver that was going too fast, we went through a sharp rain transition, the asphalt was hot, the rain was hard, and the driver in front of us had slowed down. When my driver tried to brake and change lanes around and around we went. |
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| feliz |
You bought an MDX that had been towed for 29,000 miles?:confused:
As others have said yours is the first such post I've seen on this forum in years so it's not a problem common to the vehicle. If the tires are OK I'd sure get the vehicle checked out before venturing out and risking your and other's lives. Good luck. |
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