| Jin_Chris |
Ok!, after reading lots of lots of posts/opinions about oil filter, I decided NOT to go with Honda filter (A02) for my 04 X. Maybe, I will try to find what kind of filter is available for MDX in Japan when I go there (business trip once in a while). Maybe, I will bring a box of 6~12 myself etc.
For now, I would go with Mobil-1 (M1-110). Then, my question is,
Where to buy "drain plug washers"?
We need to change the plug washer everytime I change oil right?
Thank you in advance. |
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| nightguy |
quote:
Originally posted by Jin_Chris
Ok!, after reading lots of lots of posts/opinions about oil filter, I decided NOT to go with Honda filter (A02) for my 04 X. Maybe, I will try to find what kind of filter is available for MDX in Japan when I go there (business trip once in a while). Maybe, I will bring a box of 6~12 myself etc.
For now, I would go with Mobil-1 (M1-110). Then, my question is,
Where to buy "drain plug washers"?
We need to change the plug washer everytime I change oil right?
Thank you in advance.
The dealer. Some include the washer with the filter but you should still be able to buy the washer by itself. My Honda dealer is 20 cents cheaper. :) |
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| phild_mason |
I don't bother changing the washer every time. More like every 3 or 4 times. I simply inspect it and decide if I am going to or not.
I use synth and have never had a drop of oil lost. |
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| richkuan |
quote:
Originally posted by Jin_Chris
. . . . . . .
Maybe, I will try to find what kind of filter is available for MDX in Japan when I go there (business trip once in a while). Maybe, I will bring a box of 6~12 myself etc.
. . . . . . . .
[/B]
Um, I believe Acura exists only in North America. I doubt you will see one or able to buy any MDX parts in Japan. Actually all Honda vehicles (includes Acura) now use the same filter.
I am not sure why you don't want to use the genuine filter, it's engineered for Honda vehicles. My opinion is that you don't have to pay too much attention to the oil filter, it's not that important. Replacing the oil frequently is really critical. I always change oil at 3000 miles and replace the oil filter every 2-3 oil changes.
I don't change the washer everytime, it's not necessary as long as it's not leaking. If it begins to leak, I would just tighten the plug a little more to crush the washer further (it's aluminum) and replace it next time. |
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| Jin_Chris |
richkuan
(I like your id....)
I totally 100% completely agree with you regarding engine oil maintenance.
Yes! that is exactly what I am doing for my other cars, I don't change crush washer, I use whatever available discount filter etc. And with such maintenance, my 94 acura legend is marching to 200k with 196k at current odo. My 97 Toyota 4Runner is at 110k without any single engine problem. (I do NOT mean those are completely maintenance free though).
And regarding the OEM filter, it is not because I am a lot against about OEM filter (maybe I read too much on this forum). Rather, my decision is if OEM filter is not that much beneficial, why do I bother to order it from internet vendor and wait for a week or so? I can just stop by local auto part shop and pick up a good Mobil 1 filter. If the OEM filter is readily available at lower than Mobil filter price, I would pick it up too. But I have to drive down to dealer, which is a little farther away, moreover, their price is NOT Tim's price, at least 1.5 higher than Tim's on such simple low-cost maintenance item.
By the way, regarding Acura MDX in Japan, I have to disagree with you though.
The MDX is sold in Japan under Honda. I can just visit local auto part shop or honda dealer and pick up a filter for MDX and see how is the quality. It is NOT because I am too paranoid for Japan oil filter. It is just simple for me to visit the local area where I stay in Japan. I just want to take a good advantage of the opportunity. Maybe, I would just end up picking up nothing there, who knows if Honda dealer in Japan may carry the same Canada filter.....
Anyway, I totally agree with you richkuan, I may just pick up a decent filter in local shop and reuse crush washer. Thank you for your reply.
:D :D :D |
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| frostyra |
quote:
Originally posted by richkuan
My opinion is that you don't have to pay too much attention to the oil filter, it's not that important. Replacing the oil frequently is really critical. I always change oil at 3000 miles and replace the oil filter every 2-3 oil changes.
I disagree -- that's like leaving a pint of dirty oil in the engine whenever you change the oil without changing the filter. An analogy would be drinking water from a bottle that somebody had just peed in.:16: |
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| hammermdx |
quote:
Originally posted by frostyra
I disagree -- that's like leaving a pint of dirty oil in the engine whenever you change the oil without changing the filter. An analogy would be drinking water from a bottle that somebody had just peed in.:16:
Exactly! |
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| Our MDX |
quote:
Originally posted by frostyra
I disagree -- that's like leaving a pint of dirty oil in the engine whenever you change the oil without changing the filter. An analogy would be drinking water from a bottle that somebody had just peed in.
Couldn't agree more |
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| G. COLTON |
Change oil, change filter. As said above you are leaving degraded oil in the filter even though with the small Acura filter it is not a lot. This leaves less room for the new oil. Also IF there is crud in the oil you are gradually plugging the filter and restricting flow. If then the flow bypasses the filter it is no longer doing its job.
As regards Original Equipment Manufacturer material. Generally OEM equipment is considered very average. Manufactures do not use the very best available because of cost and the bet ter manufacturers do not use bottom line equipment. It is very easy to replace OEM material with higher quality. So there is nothing majoc in replacing anything with OEM.
G |
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| hondacuraworld |
| Part number on the drain plug washer is 94109-14000, Honda's been using the same one since Carter was president. |
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| richkuan |
quote:
Originally posted by Jin_Chris
richkuan
(I like your id....)
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Thanks, I like it too......
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quote:
By the way, regarding Acura MDX in Japan, I have to disagree with you though.
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Thanks for letting me know. Never been to Japan, so it's just my reasoning.....:D
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All right, thanks for all the opinions by you guys. As to whether replacing the oil filter for each oil change, I think it's more like a personal preference based on the experience.
Leaving some used oil in the engine may not be good. But the bottom line is, there is oil left behind anyways, in the pockets of the engine component, on the internal surfaces all over the engine, etc.
So, how bad is it if used oil were left in the engine? Let's take a look at why we need to change the oil at certain mileage and why cars have different schedules -- some say 7500, some say 10000. Again, this is my personal understanding and opinions based on my experience and knowledge accumulated in the past. It may not be right and if so I appreciate if someone can correct it.
The main purposes of engine oil are 1. lubricate 2. cool the engine 3. clean the engine, and of course many other purposes. Item 3 plays the most important role when it comes to decide when to change oil. The oil consumes a lot of combustion by-product - carbon, fuel, NOx, and other pollutant, this is why the oil becomes dark soon after oil change. When the oil get saturated with these stuff, it will lost the ability to lubricate and cool down the engine and it's boiling point will change and easily solidify onto hot surfaces, it's called oil gelling. Use water as analogy, if you put enough flour into it, it will not be water anymore and will be easily burnt if you heat it.
Of course, oil will also degrade due to pressure, temperature, and other factors. But the degree it can degrade is really limited. That's why we need to recycle engine oil - it will not degrade easily and can last for loooong time. So, bottom line is, you have to change the oil before it gets saturated with particles.
Let's do some simple math. I have never put my thoughts about this into numbers before, so hopefully this makes sense to my experience and to you guys. Keep in mind, this is only reasonings based on assumptions.
Assume the manual suggests you change the oil at 7500 miles, and assume the oil is 90% saturated at that point, and assume the oil filter holds 5% of the total oil (it should be much less).
I always change oil at 3000 miles. At that point, the oil is about 40% saturated (90% x 3000/7500 = 36%). After the oil change without the changing the oil filter, the engine has 5 qt x .05 = .25 qt used oil at 40% saturated left in the engine.
After adding 4.5 qt of new oil, the level of saturation becomes .25 / 4.75 x 40% = 2%.
Here we go, if you change the oil at 7500, at the same time when I change the oil, your engine is still running on oil which is 40% dirty and mine is at only 2%.
And, if you plot a graph with mileage as X axis and % as Y axis. Draw a straight line from (0,0) to (7500, 90), this represent the number of particles in the oil wrt to mileage if you change the oil at 7500. Draw another line from (0,0) to (3000,40). Continue with a vertical line down to (3000,0), this represents the oil change. And continue with another line to (6000,40) and back to (6000,0). Calculate the areas under the straight lines. The first one has 7500*90/2 = 337,500. The second 2 triangles has 3000*40/2 * 2 = 120,000. I think this area can represent the particles your filter handles - the total loads your filter is undertaken. After 2 oil changes, the 3000-mile one is still about 1/3 of the load compared to the 7500-mile one. Hay, looks like it's OK to change the filter maybe for every 5-6 oil changes. :D :2:
Well, anyways, according my rough calculation, it looks like that the roles I followed to take care my vehicles for the past 15 years is not too off the line. And, my cars really do run great under my care. :cool:
So, I think it's safe to say
1. leaving used oil in the filter is not that bad.
2. the filter can handle well with every other oil changes.
3. change oil frequently is more helpful for your engine health.
Wow, it's a long post. Didn't realize I typed so much stuff. Hopefully you are still with me so far. :p
Oh, by the way, although I don't have the guts and probably will never try it, I heard that drinking pee is actually healthy to your body and it can cure some kind of disease. :D |
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| nightguy |
It is more likely that the filter loses efficiency at a rate not proportional to the figures you have made up here. More importantly, the filter is mounted vertically. So not only is there oil contained in the filter but in the housing and oil lines above the filter. The only way for that oil to drain out is through the filter mount. Yeah, there's still oil in the engine. With that thinking, why take out the mats when you vacuum ? Sure you've already hauled out the vacuum and cleaned 75% of the interior but why bother cleaning what you don't see ?
If you do your own maintenance and want to be sure you maintain the factory warranty, it's probably a good idea to change the oil and filter at 7,500 and have receipts for a filter that fits the MDX. Come on. They cost $6 or less which is cheap for a $40,000 vehicle. And if you change oil yourself, you've already gotten dirty opening the drain plug.
For the record, urine isn't a favorite beverage of mine, but it is sterile until it leaves the body and can be used in a life or death emergency for washing down a cold burrito before cutting your own arm off. See Aron Ralston's Between a Rock and a Hard Place. |
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| G. COLTON |
quote:
Originally posted by JimH
http://www.performancempg.com/filte...oil_filters.htm
Some general info. regarding efficiency of filtering. Changing the filter may in-fact depend on how good the oil filter is that you are using in the MDX.
Very true, if you are using an el cheapo filter that does not catch much garbage than changing it does not make much difference. |
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| vicchang |
Hi, I am new to this forum. I only browse the posts but never post a reply myself.
Anyway, after reading richkuan's post, I showed to my boyfriend who is an Acura master mechanic (he takes care of my 05 MDX, for free ):) , he was impressed about the numbers and calculation. He said in the dealership, everyone knows changing the oil more frequently then what's recommended in the manual is very important if you would like to keep the car for a long time. But this is the first time he saw someone puts it in mathematic equation and proves it. He is going to show this to other mechanics in his dealership.
He said he did exactly the same thing as richkuan does for years on his 1985 Accord. Now he knows for sure why the car still runs very well (reaching 350k). And he agrees that leaving used oil in the engine is not good, but after he read rich's calculation, he pointed out that after oil change, rich's engine has only 2% used oil, and others' are still at 100%. So use the pee as an example (although it's not an elegant example), his engine is drinking 2% pee, and others' are drinking 100% pee. Of course the 2% is much better, even without changing the filter. He said it's true for the filter also, the filter should last much longer if you change oil like that.
Anyway, thanks richkuan for sharing your knowledge. Do you have more tips to share with us? |
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| afs12065 |
When I bought my MDX I was invited to an Acura Car Care Clinic (program offered by my dealer specifically - not sure if all dealers offer it)...
So, I went and the purpose of the clinic was to go into detail on certain aspects of the individual models.
There were two points regarding oil and filter maintenance that I found interesting... The OEM filter is designed to prevent "drain back" (after you shut the engine off, preventing oil from draining out of the filter and back into pan so when you re-start, its not dry). We were told that Honda oil filters are engineered for these vehicles but there are other "high quality" filters that also provide this feature. Most "economy" lines do not.
Second, while Honda does not require it, my dealer changes the filter with each oil change (using Honda/Acura oil) as a matter of standard operating procedure siting that it is cheap insurance. I agree.
I have always changed my oil & filter every 3000 mi. I know that is old school and that with modern oil technology today (and with synthetics) that is not required but again, I like the idea of cheap insurance to extend engine life and to prevent problems down the road.
Just my $.02 |
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| richkuan |
quote:
Originally posted by vicchang
Hi, I am new to this forum. I only browse the posts but never post a reply myself.
Anyway, after reading richkuan's post, I showed to my boyfriend who is an Acura master mechanic (he takes care of my 05 MDX, for free ):) , he was impressed about the numbers and calculation. He said in the dealership, everyone knows changing the oil more frequently then what's recommended in the manual is very important if you would like to keep the car for a long time. But this is the first time he saw someone puts it in mathematic equation and proves it. He is going to show this to other mechanics in his dealership.
He said he did exactly the same thing as richkuan does for years on his 1985 Accord. Now he knows for sure why the car still runs very well (reaching 350k). And he agrees that leaving used oil in the engine is not good, but after he read rich's calculation, he pointed out that after oil change, rich's engine has only 2% used oil, and others' are still at 100%. So use the pee as an example (although it's not an elegant example), his engine is drinking 2% pee, and others' are drinking 100% pee. Of course the 2% is much better, even without changing the filter. He said it's true for the filter also, the filter should last much longer if you change oil like that.
Anyway, thanks richkuan for sharing your knowledge. Do you have more tips to share with us?
Ha, looks like only your BF really read and knew what I am writing and calculating :D. You want tips? I believe he knows tons of secrets. Lucky you. He could be a good resource for us. But I doubt he will talk much since he is the pro and lives on his knowledge :D
Well, as I said, it's just my personal preference. I am glad that someone that really knows cars agrees with my philosophy. Again, there are a lot of mis-understanding out there regarding vehicle maintenance. Just would like to share my personal experience and maybe able to clarify it. That's one of the purposes of this forum. |
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| richkuan |
I am about to do the 30k maintenance. Checked the manual to make sure I will do all the required items. I noticed something I didn't pay attention to before.
The manual clearly indicates replace the oil filter for every 2 oil changes. See the image I scanned from the 2003 MDX maunal.
Anyone still wonder why? |
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