| RCtennis3811 |
| My dad's thinking of getting one. Does anybody here have one yet? We test drove one at DFW's Infiniti M Preview Night before the vehicle was introduced into the market and my family liked it. Is it a better deal than the RL? |
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| phins2rt |
quote:
Originally posted by RCtennis3811
My dad's thinking of getting one. Does anybody here have one yet? We test drove one at DFW's Infiniti M Preview Night before the vehicle was introduced into the market and my family liked it. Is it a better deal than the RL?
Is he looking at the AWD or RWD? |
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| eRauL |
| If you are getting the M35 AWD, and adding the options to get it to RL specs, you might as well get the RL :1: |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by RCtennis3811
My dad's thinking of getting one. Does anybody here have one yet? We test drove one at DFW's Infiniti M Preview Night before the vehicle was introduced into the market and my family liked it. Is it a better deal than the RL?
I have been seriously looking at the RL and the M35 since March. After spending considerable time on RL Forums (Edmunds, acurazine, and acuraworld) I am having second thoughts about the RL. The RL is NOT selling well at all and they are having some QC issues with it; if you have not done so I urge you to spend some time on those forums. The acurazine and Edmunds forums have several comparison threads.
Back in March I was nearly 100% sold on the RL, during April I'd say it was 50-50 RL/M35; but now I leaning way toward the M35 (although I haven't made a final decision, nor am I in a hurry).
quote:
Originally posted by eRauL
If you are getting the M35 AWD, and adding the options to get it to RL specs, you might as well get the RL :1:
What kind of comment is this; have you test driven both? I can get an '06 M35 Sport w/ Journey Package, Navi, and a Full Size Spare cheaper than an '05 RL. One on my biggest issues with the new RL (besides the problems, is the cost - Acura knows it is overpriced and has already adjusted the residuals and is heavily discounting it). |
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| eRauL |
quote:
Originally posted by msu79gt82
...
What kind of comment is this; have you test driven both? I can get an '06 M35 Sport w/ Journey Package, Navi, and a Full Size Spare cheaper than an '05 RL. One on my biggest issues with the new RL (besides the problems, is the cost - Acura knows it is overpriced and has already adjusted the residuals and is heavily discounting it).
Yup.. test drove the RL, the Infi M35 AWD & M45, the BMW 530 & 545, and the Lexus GS430.
The M35 and the 530 felt underpowered.
The 545 and M45 have plenty of power and torque, but I don't like V8 engines (gaz guzzler, they are).
I like the all-included pricing of the RL. It makes the shopping less messy. Acura might want to consider the price with the crowded competition for this segment. |
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| RCtennis3811 |
| What my parents say is that all of the cars have enough power for our needs. We're actually looking at an M35x meaning AWD. We do like the interior of the M better than the RL, but the RL has a slightly easier to use nav system. |
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| msu79gt82 |
| Yea I know about the AWD option - Infiniti has a very good and proven system. The RL's system seems to be a good one as well, however its reliabilty has not been proven (and the new RL has had it share of problematic glitches). Its just that I do not need AWD here in Houston. Are your parents in DFW (I wouln't think AWD would be a necessity there either)? I'm interested in the Sport version which comes with a type of Rear Wheel Steer that is getting rave reviews for its handling. |
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| RCtennis3811 |
quote:
Originally posted by msu79gt82
Yea I know about the AWD option - Infiniti has a very good and proven system. The RL's system seems to be a good one as well, however its reliabilty has not been proven (and the new RL has had it share of problematic glitches). Its just that I do not need AWD here in Houston. Are your parents in DFW (I wouln't think AWD would be a necessity there either)? I'm interested in the Sport version which comes with a type of Rear Wheel Steer that is getting rave reviews for its handling.
AWD isn't a necessity, but my mom thinks it is - she's been stuck in DFW ice many times, but not in the MDX...so she wants AWD. |
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| Blackura |
I've owned a new 2005 RL for several months (first on the block to have one) and like it a lot. The gliches mentioned do in fact exist, but they are all in the computer system, and do not affect the reliability of the car. Software upgrades will cure the problems, no need for wrenches. Ironically, the first software "upgrade" has created more glitches than it solved. New problems with the upgrade are: auto locking tries to lock the already locked doors every so often, the XM radio now takes about 20 seconds to update the song playing on the display, and the tilt-down side view mirror doesn't always return to normal after shifting from reverse. A trifle annoying, yes. Not life threatening problems, to be sure. Next software upgrade will fix these (and possible introduce new glitches?).
As far as the RL/Infiniti M comparisons go, the M is really a very nice car and so different than the original (fugly) M they should have named is something different. I do like it from what I've seen. Even fully optioned (and priced accordingly) I don't think it offers anything the RL does not.
On the M, you can't get the RL's five channel DVD Audio system (and it's a great factory system) at any price. You also can't get the XM traffic integrated into what is already the world's best NAV system at any price. And if AWD is important to you, and it appears it is, the RL is the only place to get SH-AWD which is truly excellent. The M doesn't offer that.
Time will reveal glitches with the M, as it is too new to know right now. Hopefully it will stand the quality test over time better than some other newer Nissan designs. My initial impression is good.
Both seem to be great cars and if you have a personal preference for one over the other, I don't see how you can go wrong either way. They're both excellent choices. You may want to make dealer quality one of your decisions. If you have a great local Acura dealer and a poor Infiniti one, or vice versa, that could sway your decision. Obviously, price will play a part too. If the RL is being heavily discounted (much to my dismay, having paid sticker) and you get the aforementioned unique features go for it. With time and expanding supply, the M price will also be discounted as the bloom comes off the new rose.
Good luck with your decision and enjoy whichever one you select. |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by Blackura
On the M, you can't get the RL's five channel DVD Audio system (and it's a great factory system) at any price. ... And if AWD is important to you, and it appears it is, the RL is the only place to get SH-AWD which is truly excellent. The M doesn't offer that.
Not True! The M does offer Bose Studio Surround sound system with digital 5.1-channel decoding; 14 speakers, (plays DVD-A, DVD-V, DTS, Dolby Digital) in the Tech package. Also the M35x offers a very nice AWD system that many say (I do NOT have personal experience) is superior to SH-AWD, but in any event is a fine proven AWD system. |
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| Blackura |
I didn't realize the new M now has the DVD-A system; sorry. I didn't see anything about it in any car mag articles. The RL's audio was the talk of the trades and heralded mightily upon it's arrival. When I was shopping, the M didn't have it (the old-style M). Does the M have the traffic/NAV function too? In congested city areas, it's a brilliant idea.
Not sure about the M's AWD system either, but I can say that the Acura's SH-AWD is great and should be in the X as well. Maybe on the re-design whenever that finally happens. |
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| eurohazard |
| Interestingly when you order the Tech package on the M35x, it pushes the MSRP to $50,160.00. That would make the Acura RL less expensive. |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by Blackura
Does the M have the traffic/NAV function too? In congested city areas, it's a brilliant idea.
Not sure about the M's AWD system either, but I can say that the Acura's SH-AWD is great and should be in the X as well. Maybe on the re-design whenever that finally happens.
No the M (nor anything else either) does not offer NavTraffic - that does seem to be a very nice feature (if you live in the 21 cities that offer it). I know the RL comes with 1 Year of service. How much will the NavTraffic option cost when your first year is up?
Yes, I suspect that the redesigned MDX will have SH-AWD - I hope so. :1: |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by eurohazard
Interestingly when you order the Tech package on the M35x, it pushes the MSRP to $50,160.00. That would make the Acura RL less expensive.
True, however the Tech Package includes technology NOT available on the RL; Laser Guided Cruise Control, Preview Braking, and the Advanced Lane Departure Warning System.
Infiniti's Rear View Monitor is the most sophisticated and useful I have ever seen (the M is even better than my FX); the lack of a Back-up Camera on the RL is almost a deal killer for me :rolleyes: |
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| Blackura |
What is Preview Braking?
The laser cruise might be nice, I think. Depends on how well it is designed. The early versions were not very good (very herky-jerky), but I suspect it must have been improved by now.
As the the lane departure warning, if you really can't keep your car between the lines you should probably consider putting down your bottle of Stoli while you are driving. |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by Blackura
What is Preview Braking?
The laser cruise might be nice, I think. Depends on how well it is designed. The early versions were not very good (very herky-jerky), but I suspect it must have been improved by now.
As the the lane departure warning, if you really can't keep your car between the lines you should probably consider putting down your bottle of Stoli while you are driving.
Preview Braking = the system uses the Intelligent Cruise Control laser sensors to detect vehicles ahead. If it senses a rapidly slowing vehicle ahead of you in the same lane, it automatically pre-pressurizes the braking system in anticipation of emergency braking and can improve response to sudden driver input.
My FX has Laser Cruise and it works well; however I consider it an on-the-road (highway driving feature only).
I am undecided about the LDW - perhaps useful on the tail end of late night road trips. |
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| msu79gt82 |
Compared the M35 with the GS300:
Wow what a difference in markups!! Just used Edmunds to Price two comparable configurations available in my area and I'm shocked at the markup differences. The Lexus has double the markup ~ $8000 vs. $4000.
Lexus GS300 w/ ML Nav Package, Moonroof, Rain-Sensing Wipers, Parking Assist, Ventilated Seats, Spoiler, Power Rear SunShade = MSRP of $50,215 and Invoice of $42,542
Infiniti M35 w/ Journey, Nav, and Full Size Spare = MSRP of $45,740 and Invoice of $41,795.
I am well aware of Lexus' reputation for customer service (enough folks on this board have touted it); but I suppose for double the markup over Infiniti the customer service SHOULD be better - your paying for it. :rolleyes: |
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| Desant |
I just test drove M35x and I am sold! Wow! I love the way it looks, inside materials, design, features, speed and handling.
I can't wait to get a used one maybe in 1-2 years! I haven't been so anxious to get any vehicle for a long time. The last time it was after I first test drove MDX in 2001 and bought my first one in 2002. |
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| SuperTech |
| Why are all these new mid size luxury cars coming with all wheel drive? It just doesn't seem like the people buying cars in this segment would ever use it. They don't come with very good snow tires, so you'd still need to chain up if you took it in the snow. Yet here they are. The RL, M35, E350 4Matic, and the STS. The one that can outhandle them all? The rear drive only BMW 530 with sport package. And specifically for the RL...it wasn't worth the weight penalty (despite the use of carbon fiber prop shaft and all aluminum suspension) to try and get "super handling." The front drive TL feels like a better corner carver than the RL. However...the RL has a way better build quality, a more luxurious feel, and a few more high tech toys. The touch ensitive door handles are easily the coolest feature of the RL. |
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| eRauL |
quote:
Originally posted by SuperTech
Why are all these new mid size luxury cars coming with all wheel drive?
I wonder who started the trend. Is Acura RL the first one with AWD or is it BMW 5??x? |
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| SuperTech |
| The Bimmer is offering AWD for the '06 model 530, but hasn't previously. RL has only been on the market for 8 months or so. Mercedes has been doing the 4Matics for several years now. Even Jaguar has had an AWD X-type availble for a few years. But Audi has been pushing its quattro setup on their entire lineup and not just the mid size luxury...for a long, LONG time. If anyone can be blamed...it's them. |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by SuperTech
Why are all these new mid size luxury cars coming with all wheel drive?
Actually only the RL comes with all wheel drive. Its an option on the other cars. M35, GS, etc come "standard" with rear wheel drive, but can be gotten with all wheel drive. Here in Houston the M35X is a special order, however in the snow states its the most common. |
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| Desant |
Yeap, living in a snow state, AWD really helps. I wouls till get probably snow tires for snow and ice, but I would not want to get a rear-wheel drive.
M35x, RL, BMW 530x, A6 and others combine the elements of a mid-size luxo sedan and comfortable winter handling. |
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| SuperTech |
quote:
Originally posted by msu79gt82
Actually only the RL comes with all wheel drive. Its an option on the other cars. M35, GS, etc come "standard" with rear wheel drive, but can be gotten with all wheel drive. Here in Houston the M35X is a special order, however in the snow states its the most common.
The Audi A6 is AWD only too isn't it?
It must be proof that people are more well to do these days. In the past, if you lived in the snow states, and absolutely insisted on having a car instead of a 4wd truck or SUV (with more ground clearance to get over snow patches), you got a Subaru. And even Subarus had a little more than average ground clearance. Now we have the luxo boats posing as snowmobiles. For light snow, they're OK. But then again a driver who isn't an idiot with proper snow tires or chains can get by without AWD in those conditions. But for heavy snow, all cars like this are going to be are just $50,000 snowplows. |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by SuperTech
The Audi A6 is AWD only too isn't it?
Yea I forgot about that one, my bad. |
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| eurohazard |
I just drove a 2006 M35 with tech pkg. I really wanted to like this car. Both the wife and I think the car looks terrific.
I was shocked by a few things. First the Nav is overly complicated. I much prefer the touchscreen as opposed to the dial/button system. Second the rear seat area is snug to say the least. Legroom back there isn't too bad, but no good. The problem is headroom to the roof, but also the headroom comes in too much from the sides. 3rd, the laser cruise didn't impress me. 4th, when you go to reverse, the driver mirror tilts down, but not the passenger side. I like the MDXs system better.
On the plus side, the rear view camera has moving lines that guide you as you park. The car handles well, and accelerates nicely. |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by eurohazard
I just drove a 2006 M35 with tech pkg. I really wanted to like this car. Both the wife and I think the car looks terrific.
I was shocked by a few things. First the Nav is overly complicated. I much prefer the touchscreen as opposed to the dial/button system. Second the rear seat area is snug to say the least. Legroom back there isn't too bad, but no good. The problem is headroom to the roof, but also the headroom comes in too much from the sides. 3rd, the laser cruise didn't impress me. 4th, when you go to reverse, the driver mirror tilts down, but not the passenger side. I like the MDXs system better.
On the plus side, the rear view camera has moving lines that guide you as you park. The car handles well, and accelerates nicely.
Well go look at the new RL :rolleyes: Touch Screen Navi is gone on it; I actually prefer the M35's interface to the new Acura one. Also in its size class it has more room than the new RL or the new GS300. Like the MDX the tilt-down mirrors are user definable - the M35 passenger mirror does tilt-down. My FX35 has Laser Cruise and its an OK feature, I can take it or leave it (its more for the open highway). Apparently the '06 RL is going to offer a Tech Package that includes Laser Cruise.
I am in the market for a new sedan and I tried very hard to like the new RL, but I just can't do it :o Since I am not is a hurry I may wait until the '06 RL comes out in October. But for now I am leaning toward the M35.
By the way did you see the new Consumer Reports reviews of Luxury AWD Sedans? The new '06 M35x is now CR's highest rated vehicle period; scoring higher than the LS430 :cool: :1: The RL scored OK, however they really scored the new GS300 AWD very low :eek: |
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| JL_SS |
quote:
Originally posted by msu79gt82
Well go look at the new RL :rolleyes: Touch Screen Navi is gone on it; I actually prefer the M35's interface to the new Acura one. Also in its size class it has more room than the new RL or the new GS300. Like the MDX the tilt-down mirrors are user definable - the M35 passenger mirror does tilt-down. My FX35 has Laser Cruise and its an OK feature, I can take it or leave it (its more for the open highway). Apparently the '06 RL is going to offer a Tech Package that includes Laser Cruise.
I am in the market for a new sedan and I tried very hard to like the new RL, but I just can't do it :o Since I am not is a hurry I may wait until the '06 RL comes out in October. But for now I am leaning toward the M35.
By the way did you see the new Consumer Reports reviews of Luxury AWD Sedans? The new '06 M35x is now CR's highest rated vehicle period; scoring higher than the LS430 :cool: :1: The RL scored OK, however they really scored the new GS300 AWD very low :eek:
Saw the CR article, they really are not impressed with the RL (FWIW) rating it well below the TL. |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by JL_SS
Saw the CR article, they really are not impressed with the RL (FWIW) rating it well below the TL.
All I said was it scored "OK"; look at the overall score - its a good score. But CR was not overly impressed were they? Yes CR really likes the TL, which is now their 3rd highest rated sedan behind the M35 and the LS430. I have said it often on this board that the MDX is best-bang-for-the-buck SUV out there; and ditto the TL. :1: I started looking into a new sedan back in March and immediatley considered the RL to be way over-priced at $49+K :eek: Even though heavily discounted today I do not consider the RL to be a good value. Also what does that say, that after just 5 months of sales Acura had to start heavily discounting a brand new model :rolleyes: |
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| wmquan |
quote:
Originally posted by JL_SS
Saw the CR article, they really are not impressed with the RL (FWIW) rating it well below the TL.
FWIW, Edmunds' subjective rating has the RL #1 in a comparison of AWD luxury sedans. The M35x was #3.
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/d...rticleId=106555
Both vehicles beat the BMW 530xi and Lexus GS300 AWD. |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by wmquan
FWIW, Edmunds' subjective rating has the RL #1 in a comparison of AWD luxury sedans. The M35x was #3.
Both vehicles beat the BMW 530xi and Lexus GS300 AWD.
Yea I thought is was an odd comparo - Edmunds made no secret of the fact that they did NOT like the M's styling at all. Reading their commentary is was clear that the M would have scored higher if performance/handling was the only criteria. Thats the only the comparo the RL has won.
Speaking of comparos - the new GS has been almost universally panned :eek: |
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| eRauL |
quote:
Originally posted by msu79gt82
...
Speaking of comparos - the new GS has been almost universally panned :eek:
Isn't the GS based on Toyota Avalon? |
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| wmquan |
quote:
Originally posted by msu79gt82
Yea I thought is was an odd comparo - Edmunds made no secret of the fact that they did NOT like the M's styling at all. Reading their commentary is was clear that the M would have scored higher if performance/handling was the only criteria. Thats the only the comparo the RL has won.
Speaking of comparos - the new GS has been almost universally panned :eek:
Edmunds seems to make the common criticism of Infinitis -- "lowest scores for interior design and materials quality" -- though they did acknowledge improvement.
They did find the slalom time slower than the BMW and RL, but overall liked the performance/handling of the V6-equipped Infiniti.
The "Second Opinions" in their comparo are pretty revealing as to how they felt. They didn't really focus on the styling.
quote:
Although quick and nimble, the M35x came across as a loudmouth. Short gearing has the V6 revving up a storm the whole time you're in the car, and the chassis is stiff to the point of dulling sensations that keep you from doing something unwise. And the driving position and control layout were awkward. I always felt like I was driving somebody else's car.
quote:
Going into the test, I thought the Infiniti M35x would be my favorite. It has an outstanding V6, all-wheel drive and performance suspension. Unfortunately, all the performance stuff I mentioned started to grate on me after 200 miles in the car. The exhaust note got annoying, the "sporty" ride started to bother my back, and the trans shifts felt a bit too snappy. This is a good car, but Infiniti needs to sand off a few of the rough edges.
I guess it comes down to them thinking it's not "refined" enough for a luxury sedan. Obviously that's a highly subjective viewpoint. |
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| eurohazard |
quote:
Isn't the GS based on Toyota Avalon?
Funny you ask that! I also drove a 2006 Avalon, and the guy at Toyota was telling me that it was the "same" as the GS.
But I don't buy it at all. The Avalon is front wheel drive, and the GS is rear wheel drive, and I think an AWD option(?). |
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| MDX4now |
I too was going back and forth between the RL and the M35, and I've decided to go with the M35 to replace my old Toyota Avalon.
And I know this sounds stupid, but I *may* have gone with the RL as it's almost 10K cheaper, but it didn't have backup camera....completely stupid reason, but in addition to the after mentioned problems with the RL, that was like the tip of the ice burg for me...
I'm getting a M35x with the all wheel drive, and Premium Package with about everything possible including rear dvd, reclining seats, etc.
My wife thinks I'm crazy, but that's what she gets for not letting me get the rear seat dvd in the MDX 3 years ago! What can I say? I like my gadgets! |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by MDX4now
And I know this sounds stupid, but I *may* have gone with the RL as it's almost 10K cheaper, but it didn't have backup camera....completely stupid reason, but in addition to the after mentioned problems with the RL, that was like the tip of the ice burg for me...
I'm getting a M35x with the all wheel drive, and Premium Package with about everything possible including rear dvd, reclining seats, etc.
Actually a "comparably" equiped M35x is about the same price as the RL. Your M35x may cost $10K more but that is no longer comparable, but even more loaded.
A fully loaded M has a better sound system, Rear DVD system, Laser Guided Cruise, Lane Departure Warning System, cooling front seats, back-up camera, rear heated & reclining seats, etc - things not available on the RL. |
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| MDX4now |
| I really like the M35x so that's why I've been able to justify paying around $51K (trade not included) rather than a $49K Acura that I can buy for $42K....but you're right on the money regarding the extra fearures in the M! |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by MDX4now
I really like the M35x so that's why I've been able to justify paying around $51K (trade not included) rather than a $49K Acura that I can buy for $42K....but you're right on the money regarding the extra fearures in the M!
Yep that what I meant, a nice M35 can be had for about $43 to $44. I too am leaning toward a M35, although not quite as loaded (I do not need DVD MES for example). Please post back after you've go it with more info :cool: :1: |
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| eurohazard |
msu79gt82.......I didn't mention it when I did my test drive, but, there were quite a few M35s on my local dealer lot. In fact the salesperson, though nice, was actually quite pushy about "getting me into one". So much so that he introduced me to a manager who also wanted to talk numbers.
I think Infiniti sales have slumped seriously during the Ford, GM, and DC "employee pricing" period. I don't have numbers to back it up, but just my theory right now.
My point is: They might be able to give you a good deal on a new Infiniti! |
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| msu79gt82 |
quote:
Originally posted by eurohazard
msu79gt82.......I didn't mention it when I did my test drive, but, there were quite a few M35s on my local dealer lot.
My point is: They might be able to give you a good deal on a new Infiniti!
You could be right, I took my FX35 in for an oil change last week and there were a lot of M's on the lot. Maybe the new car rush is slacking off a little. |
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| msu79gt82 |
New (sort of new) Infiniti M Forum.
www.infinitimclub.com
This is a forum that I found back in March and tried to join in April with no success. However it appears to be up and running now; there were new posts dated 8/15 - I joined and began posting.
Anyone interested in the new M-Series give it a shot. |
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| msu79gt82 |
Well the forum I linked above, though technically active, is more or less dormant with virtually no activity. :rolleyes:
I recently came across another dedicated M forum that is actualy active: www.infiniti-driver.com |
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