| manus1980 |
| I saw a paid advertisement for a round metal cylinder called the air tornado. It's an attachment to the engine air intake that causes the air to spin thus moving faster into the engine. It supposedly increased the horses and mileage on any auto it was used on. So far I've gotten mixed reviews depending on who I ask. Does anybody know if it works? If so, can it be used on the MDX? |
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| roadrunner |
I'm no engineer, and I don't know dink about air flow and engine performance. But I have learned a few things about the way the world works.
I recently saw a book about the mysterious face on Mars. The author claimed that 1)it was proof that intelligent beings had once been on Mars and 2) that NASA was covering it up. Well, I've never been to Mars to check it out in person but I KNOW this. IF there was ANY evidence of intelligent life having ever been on Mars then the long postponed Mars Mission program would be funded in a heartbeat and NASA's fondest dream would come true. So believe me, if NASA had a picture that really showed a face on Mars they would personally hand deliver a 16x20 enlargement to every newspaper and magazine in America.
So I know that every car maker in America is squeezed between meeting Federal gas mileage standards and meeting customer expectations and competition for power and performance. Something that would deliver a 10% power and mileage increase for the same size engine would be a HUGE competitive advantage and could make a car worth several thousand more on the market. So I'm no engineer, but I know that the car makers have a LOT of engineers desperately trying to squeeze a few percentage points of performance out of their cars. If there was really a $70 device that did make miraculous performance gains, what are the odds that not a single manufacturer is clever enough to read that ad. And this isn't even new, according to their website this miracle has been on sale since at least 1997. So you can be sure that if it worked it would already be on your car. |
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| lombarmj |
| ... I too am an engineer, and agree with roadrunner. Interesting stuff about that face on Mars though :D |
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| roadrunner |
Like I said, I'm not an engineer BUT image analysis IS what I do for a living. The Cydonia face on Mars was a lot of fun although I never found it very convincing personally. One thing you learn is how powerful the compulsion is to SEE patterns in things and the idea of a monument made by intelligent hands on Mars is very very compelling.
Unfortunately, the better the image quality, the harder it becomes to convince yourself that the formations there look like a face. The newest (May 2001) high resolution images are the most damning of all but some folks will keep hoping.
2001 Cydonia Face on Mars Images
Believe me when I say, no one wishes more than I that the face was real because I believe that going to Mars would be an exciting and inspiring national goal. |
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| MGTD |
While some mixing of air and fuel takes place and this is helped by turbulance, the truth is that a non turbulant flow of air (laminar) is the most efficient on getting air into the engine. This is one of the main reasons that people polish their intakes on suped up engines.
Also wasn't it Hemi engines that had smooth intake to exhaust flows (being a straight shot) to aid in efficent movement of intake and exhaust gasses?
Chris |
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| ghotie |
| Obviously, that's a Martian face!! :eek: |
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| roadrunner |
Getting back to the original question that started this string, I have finally located an earlier string that I vaguely remembered:
quote:
Originally posted by Crem de la SUV
Would one of you fine people with the service manual please tell me more about those seemingly useless extensions on the plenum between the air filter box and the throttle body?
All I can figure is that they have to do with the tuning of the intake induction, or serve to cancel noise (or enhance the sound?).
I didn't look inside, but there are no external connections. Never quite seen anything like them. Weird.
The general conclusion was that no one knew exactly what these gizmos were except they were obviously designed to control the airflow. Given that those clever Honda engineers have obviously addressed the matter of the incoming air flow with some diligence , I would be extremely reluctant to alter their design with some universal one- type-fits-all-cars $70 gizmo. I suspect that you might change engine characteristics in unpredictable and probably undesirable ways.
Meep Meep
Meep Meep |
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| acuruss |
quote:
Originally posted by roadrunner
Getting back to the original question that started this string, I have finally located an earlier string that I vaguely remembered:
The general conclusion was that no one knew exactly what these gizmos were except they were obviously designed to control the airflow...
I think Creme was right on. I did not respond to the initial thread because I was waiting to get my MDX to investigate. These are called Helmholtz Resonators and are very common in new vehicle intake systems in tuning noise. When you accelerate, the growl you here is coming mostly from the intake system, not the exhaust system. Here's an interesting item on intake noise and tuning from http://www.sae.org/automag/globalview_12-99/04.htm:
quote:
Interestingly, the performance characteristics of the Fiesta's Zetec-S engine are emphasized by its sound, an increasingly important design and marketing element. It has been tuned by Ford's acoustic engineering team to provide a distinctly sporting note during hard acceleration, which Ford described as "functional harmony." To achieve this, the air intake system has been tuned, the sound achieved being based on research and acoustic engineering experience gained when the Puma coupe was under development. The Fiesta uses a quarter-wave tube and Helmholtz resonator within the air cleaner assembly, and a porous air intake duct located to ensure the desired sound is mainly audible internally rather than to the outside environment.
I agree that you would want to stay away from the Tornado. I would also recommend that you stay away from non-paper air filter elements. The cleanable elements simply are not as efficient at removing fine particles. |
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| roadrunner |
Thanks for that follow-up, that's really interesting. I have two comments:
One - They did a great job because the engine sounds great. Even an old fudd like me who got his hot-rod jollies almost four decades ago, can get a charge out of standing on the gas and listening to that V-Tech ROAR :D :D
Two - I think it unlikely that engineers that took that kind of trouble over the SOUND of the engine would then overlook a simple cheap device that would deliver power and/or mileage increase up to 24%:rolleyes:
Meep Meep |
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| acuruss |
| I definitely agree with both your points, roadrunner. I noticed these tubes are seperate pieces held on by a hose clamp. It would be interesting to pull one or both tubes off, making sure to plug them off, and see just what it sounds like. Or, you could use the Helmholtz equations and design your own sound! |
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| msu79gt82 |
| ... is the kind that screws onto two two-litre coke bottles. Fill one bottle up with colored water and turn it over and - tornado! Its pretty cool, all kids need one.:D :cool: :D |
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| 7plus |
Don't you think multi-billion dollar auto manufacturers are interested in improving gas mileage and increasing horse power?
Tornados, magnets, inline heaters for the gas line...
If such simple devices worked, they would already be in all our cars now.
(PS. We are not alone) |
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| Doug |
I saw the same commercial for the Tornado fuelsaver. Since it promises a 30 day money back guarantee, I thought I gave it a try! I bought one for our 95 MB E320, and one for our '01 Blk/Blk MDX Touring W/Nav.
It took me about 30 minutes to install the one in the E320, and I do notice some performance improvement. The E320 now picks up faster from the stop, and also has better passing power. All of you who have older MB's know that they tend to be pretty heavy, but the Tornado appears to make it feel "lighter!" With 217hp, the E320 is no slacker, but it adds a little more oomph to the engine!
Just to be sure it's not just my imagination, I asked a couple of people to drive to MB to see if they feel any difference, and they all noticed a difference.
I used to cruise at 65mph at about 3200 rpm, now it's below 2900 rpm. So I assume I get better fuel economy because of that! (Can anyone verify)
I have not been able to install the Tornado in the MDX because it takes a little more work, and the removal of the engine cover. And that I'm less brave to experiment with the new car! With the experience I have with the E320, I think I'll go ahead to put it in the MDX and see if it works.
Doug;) |
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| gokings55 |
| My salesperson told me if you remove the engine cover you will void your warranty, so DON"T DO IT! |
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| mogur |
Pure and simple: The Tornado is pure snake oil. If it worked so well, do you not think that every car manufacturer would make it standard?
As far as your rpm is concerned, your car has a lockup torque converter and unless you have had a major transmission failure, the rpm at a given cruise speed will always be the same. Even without lockup, the rpm required to maintain a given cruise speed is determined by parasitic and aerodynamic drag.
Engine efficency and fuel economy have absolutely no effect on that. Such a statement makes me very suspect of any other improvement claims.
Tom
quote:
Originally posted by Doug
I used to cruise at 65mph at about 3200 rpm, now it's below 2900 rpm. So I assume I get better fuel economy because of that! (Can anyone verify)
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| megabuck2 |
It seems Acura took the Tornado "idea" and built it into the MDX engine. If you read the 2001 Brochure - under "Remarkable New Engine....", it reads "...timing of the two intake valves for a given cylinder is slightly staggered. This creates a swirl effect in the fuel/air mixture in the combustion chamber, which enhances efficiency, resulting in more torque at low revolutions for better acceleration, and more power...."
Now, I have no idea whether the "Tornado" works or not, but maybe it has some validity to it.
Mike |
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