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| We are trying to decide between the MDX and a '98 or '99 Toyota Land Cruiser (which we can get for approx. current dealer cost = $38-41K). The biggest advantage the Land Cruiser has (in my mind) is that it is a well established design line, while the MDX is fresh out of the gate. Other than that, the fact that the Land Cruiser will likely have 40K+ miles of someone else's use, and is all that much more of a gas/space hog lessens it in my mind. BUT, I don't necessarily relish in the role of new-line guinea pig. Any thought are appreciated. Thanks. |
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The most important difference between these two is off-road ability. The Landcruiser is a REAL SUV with good ground clearance - a true off-road vehicle capable of climbing rocks and boulders. The MDX is a hybrid with very limited capabilities due to it's lack of low range and more importantly relatively low GROUND CLEARANCE and a relatively bad departure angle (The maximum angle between the rear wheel and bumper that can clear without anything touching). If your agenda does not include any rock climbing the MDX would be a better choice but a more important consideration would be RELIABILITY.
The Toyota Landcruiser has been AS RELIABLE AS THE SUN THAT COMES UP EVERY MORNING. Don't Know about the Acura - But the Honda Odyssey that that the MDX is loosely based on has had a less-than-desirable reliability rating - For this reason alone, I would wait until the 2002 model year at least - unless you need a car right now-then I would lean more toward the Toyota |
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vicpai:
Thanks for your thoughts. Fortunately, we DO have to purchase something before May as we have a new addition to the family on the way.
as for the use of the vehicle, it will primarily be used by my wife during the week for tasks around town/on the freeway. On the weekends we are often in places where 4WD is a good idea but not in a 'surmount all obstacles' sort of way (usually just muddy, gravelly or slick roads).
Really my biggest concerns are reliability and safety. That the MDX may get 30-40% better gas mileage than the LC, and is less of a beast, is also appealing.
Assuming our needs can be met adequately by both (and the price is similar), maybe a question more to the point is: is a 2 year old LC with 35-40k miles on it (i.e., near or past its 36k std warranty) a better move than a new MDX w/ the 4yr/50k warranty in place? Thanks. |
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| Isaac |
Here's something else to consider.
If you need the vehicle by May, you may not be able to get an MDX in time. The waiting lists in some areas are that long.
For the uses that you mentioned, the MDX will be more than sufficient, and probably a heck of a lot easier and more comfortable to drive for your wife.
As to reliability, yes I think the LandCruiser is rock solid. But then, so is just about every other Honda I know about.
You may see the odd complaint about CD buttons on the MDX here, but I haven't heard of anything else.
I think everyone who got their MDX (me included) have been pretty happy , no complaints or reliability problems. |
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Thanks for your thoughts, Isaac.
We are currently on a wait list and all indications are for a early- to mid-April delivery (for whatever that's worth). We'll have to see how things play out.
Are you familiar at all with the negative experiences people have had with the Honda Odessey? We have had good luck with the Honda Prelude we currently own, and would hope that Honda/Acura will live up to their rep. What would you say is the least appealing thing about your MDX?
BTW, we would never consider buying an America vehicle in its first model year, so despite Honda's good rep I'm still a bit hesitant. Our dealer has assured me that I can bail on the order at any time, even after delivery, should I change my mind (i.e., if we buy an LC or start hearing of problems with the MDX). Thanks again for your input. |
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...and it is BIG.
But seriously I don't think you can really do a straight comparison of the MDX with a 98-99 Toyota Land Cruiser.
The LC will be used, and the rate of deprication on any used vehicle (save a true collectible) will not compare well with that of a very well recieved new car/new model. Mechanically the Acura shares the 3.5 V6 with the RL, much of the accessories are off the Honda corporate shelf. The drivetrain is new, but Honda has a good reputation for durability. The major complaints against the Odyssey have been noises (and given that MANY owners are moving from Accords, ANY noise is foreign to them...) and minor problems with guages (that I believe are being fixed under warranty).
The LC compares very well with vehicles like the Expedition, Yukon, Navigator -- much larger and "truckier" than the MDX. The size of MDX is NOT in that class. Of the vehicles it does compare with (ML320, RX300, BMW X5, Jeep Grand Cherokee) it has the largest usable passenger volume and the most accessible cargo volume (as measured by the "biggest rectangle" method). Further it has the highest level of standard features, that tend to "lock in" resale value.
Honda/Acura invests alot in "first year satisfaction" but with a two+ year old LC you would be at mercy of previous owners maintence/abuse. I would not hesitate to buy a NEW Acura. I personally would abhor the fuel (lack) of fuel economy in the LC.
Many dealers are expecting production to "ramp up" as Honda has proven quite adept at delivering when they have high demand. The Accord earned a place on the "best seller" list through excellence in manufacturing, not giant rebates, fleet sales are hyped up ads...
The LC will always be a "specialty vehicle"-- passionately loved by some but unknown to many.
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renov8r:
Thanks for your thoughts on the matter.
Quick question re: resale. Although we plan to acessorize some (base rack, sunroof shield, side steps), we aren't really interested in the Nav or Touring packages. Since our plan is to hold onto the vehicle for as long as practicable, should the lack of more expensive "upgrades" be a concern?
I too am quite turned off by the LC's bad gas mileage. Strange, too, that the LC's V8 apparently has less horsepower than the MDX's V6. Considering the LC is so much heavier, I guess that may explain why it is quite a bit slower off the mark than the MDX (in my test drives anyway). One thing I really liked about both vehicles was the stability when I jumped hard on the brakes: on a backroad from 60mph to complete stop "no-hands" both tracked straight as an arrow. |
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There are a string of luxury car dealers walking distance from my home so I tend to keep a pretty close watch on used car prices. The trends I have seen is that vehicles with with large number of accesories tend to move MUCH quicker than those with lite options. The selling price spread is not as large as on new cars though --
For example around Thanksgiving the Lexus dealer had three used '99 RX300's. The first one was loaded with EVERYTHING including the Nakamici & gold emblems. The next one had 4X4 sunroof and a plain CD. The third was a very lightly optioned $X4 wagon. Mileage was like 34K, 37K, 28K. Pricing was $32K, $30.5K, $29.7K. The first one sold before the end of November, th second before Christmas and the third was there till middle of January. Which one "retained" the most value? Probably the mid-options one, but clearly somebody really like the loadd one.
I've seen the same thing at the BMW store and the Audi store. Loaded cars often don't command the greatest percentage of resale, but sell quicker -- much quicker than strippers. Unfortunatley the Mercededs dealer doesn't leave alot of cars out, and the Acura store is much further away. Finally, with the small number of options and high level of "standard" content I would thing the MDX is gonna be a very good performer in the "retained value resale" market. |
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| Isaac |
quote:
Originally posted by ghm2112
Thanks for your thoughts, Isaac.
We are currently on a wait list and all indications are for a early- to mid-April delivery (for whatever that's worth). We'll have to see how things play out.
Are you familiar at all with the negative experiences people have had with the Honda Odessey? We have had good luck with the Honda Prelude we currently own, and would hope that Honda/Acura will live up to their rep. What would you say is the least appealing thing about your MDX?
BTW, we would never consider buying an America vehicle in its first model year, so despite Honda's good rep I'm still a bit hesitant. Our dealer has assured me that I can bail on the order at any time, even after delivery, should I change my mind (i.e., if we buy an LC or start hearing of problems with the MDX). Thanks again for your input.
Hmm...not sure about the quality issues with the MDX. I haven't had any, and I'm told the plant in Ontario where they're built is the highest quality rated car plant (of any manufacturer) in North America.
I'm closing in on 3 months / 3000km and so far I've had zero problems with it.
What don't I like about the MDX? Many :) all minor things. Just keep in mind this comes from a guy who prefers to toot around in a little GS-R.
- It's too fat, wide. But then, so is the Land Cruiser.
- Don't like the rear-end that much. Love the front end.
- Bad mileage. Good for SUV though.
- Left foot "dead pedal" position sucks.
- I hate the foot operating parking brake.
My passengers love riding in this thing though, they have no complaints except "what? you don't have a DVD player in it?" ;)
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ghm2112,
Here is my experience over the past 18 years with first model year cars:
1982 Honda Accord - Lot of little problems and dealer installed cruise control screwed up vacuum system.
1983 Toyota Supra - no problems
1984 Audi 4000 Quattro - no problems
1987 Mazda RX-7 - no problems
1988 BMW 325ix - no problems
1990 Eagle Talon AWD - no problems
1993 Jeep Grand Cherokee - coil went out, rattles, loud transmission, and catalytic converter went out.
Notice a trend here, the only vehicle with major problems was American. The Eagle Talon had a Mitsubishi drive train and was made in their joint venture Bloomington, IL plant. Yeah the one with all the sexual harrassment claims. The only exception was the 1982 Accord and I am probably one of the only humans on the planet that has not had anything but great experiences with Honda Accords. This car was one of the very first off the assembly line in Japan for that model year and I have always attributed my problems to this and not Honda in general. I hope that this might help assuage your concerns about first year vehicle quality. In my experience, the manufacturer is a better indicator of quality than the model year for what it is worth. |
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remery:
thanks for your input. if the MDX were being manufactured by an American auto company, I don't think we would even consider it. although improving, it seems pretty clear that the Big 3 have problems with new lines. here's hoping that Acura/Honda live up to their rep! |
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