| MDXLuvr |
Hey guys- I need help stat! Found out my wife is pregnant, our 1st. anyways, need to find a camcorder that will occasionally dub as a digital camera. unfortunately, i don't have a clue. The last time i was looking at camcorders, then came in vhs or beta. :rolleyes:
so, where do i start? do i need DV? any good sites for info? what about quality/reliability. Since i am not much of a camera/camcorder fanatic, i am hoping to pay less than $1000. let me know if you think this is an unrealistic price.
thanx in advance. |
|
|
| Warzau |
First CONGRATS!!!!
I bought my first DV/digital camera last year for my little girl's birth. Fortunantly 1k is a realistically set price for a dual purpose DV you may go over or under. I bought a Sony PC-110 great DV camcorder, great carl zeiss lens. adequate digital camera 1.2 mega pixel. Really good for those times you are caught without a camera and just have the camcorder. The fun part is when you edit you movies on you computer. I have been editing movies using a firewire connection on my DV camcorder. Its great but takes up alot of space. I like Panys too great price vs Sony. Remember though each have their own propietary memory for digital photo storage. it's late right now so I can get into specifics other than I wrote. but if you have any questions go ahead and IM me. |
|
|
| TYP |
HI..
YES.. I THINK THE SONY'S ARE NICE..
BUT DEPENDS ON WHERE AND HOW YOU GIONG TO VIEW IT.
I HAD A CLASS WHERE WE ALL USE THE CANNON ZR-10(NOW IT'S OLD AND BEING REPLACED)
AND I PULG IT INTO MY MAC G4'S FIREWIRE, EDIT IT WITH THE FREE IMOVIE,
BACK TO THE ZR-10, THEN STRIGHT ONTO THE VCR.
EVERYTHING WAS FINE TO ME... BUT IF YOU WANNA VIEW IT ON THE BIG SCREEN,
WITH FINER DETIAL.. MIGHT WANNA TRY SOMETHING ON THE HIGH END.
ZR-10 SHOULD BE AROUND 400 NOW.. THE NEW ZR-20 IS ABOUT 500 NOW..
I HEAR GOOD THINGS ABOUT THE SONY.. BUT NEVER TRIED IT.. SO CAN'T TELL U..
YOU MIGHT ALSO WANT TO THINK ABOUT USING THE DV AS CAMERA,
CAUSE SOME OF THEM DOES HAVE THE FUNTION.
^__^
TYP |
|
|
| Maik |
I own and use a Sony Digital Mini DV from the TRV line which I thoroughly enjoy using. While mine has the capability of taking stills, and recording on a memory stick, the quality is quite weak as it is only 1.2 megapixals. On the other hand, the clarity of the movies is spectacular and the ease of use is wonderful. I view the movies via an infrared connection on our 65 inch TV and it is truly spectacular. The other atvantage of a mini is the size. It is no problem taking it anywhere as it is quite small and lightweight. While I understand your desire to spend as little as possible, at $1,000 you are real close to a fine piece of equipment. Your kids will only be young once, wait on some MDX accessory that you can get later and get a camcorder that you will be happy with. Afterall, you can spend $750 on a camera that will spend most of its time in a closet, or $1,250 on one that you can't wait to use!
As was previously posted, I connect to my PC via a firewire and edit the movies for further recording on a DVD or tape. You can also freeze fram and capture individual frames for great quality stills.
Good luck! |
|
|
| A2MDXer |
| If you don't need both features in one unit and want better pictures, I would go with a relatively cheap DV camcorder (about $500-600) and get a separate digital camera (you can get a 3 Meg.pxl model for around $350). I like Sony for the camcorder. I like having them separate so I don't always need to bring the camcorder if I just want pics. Also, with two you can do pics while your partner takes video. |
|
|
| DaleB |
I use the 110 as a still camera on occasion. Having the capability is nice for that special shot when you are normally shooting video.
Being ultra compact, the 110 and my DSC85 makes great companions in one relatively small camera bag.
Plus I only need one charger and the same type battery for both, and they both take memory sticks. It's very convenient. |
|
|
| roadrunner |
Although no camcorder will do as good a job as a digital still camera - just like digital still cameras never make as good a movie - if you want a camcorder to do it all take a look at the Sony TRV740:
15x optical/420x digital zoom
2.5" SwivelScreen color LCD monitor
1/4.7" Advanced HAD CCD imager, 1 million pixels
520 lines of horizontal resolution
Super SteadyShot picture stabilization
Super NightShot and Color Slow Shutter for low-light shots
Digital still memory mode and MPEG Movie EX mode, which extends MPEG recording time via Memory Stick media (8MB media included)
i.LINK (IEEE 1394) DV interface and built-in USB terminal for high-speed digital data transfer
Print Image Matching (PIM) technology
Playback zoom
Digital program editing, fader modes, digital picture effects and picture effect modes
It's a great camcorder and because of the Megapixel size chip. it can do some pretty good snaps.
It is currently $800 at BestBuy
I have the slightly older TRV730 and have been blown away by the video quality. A lot of the footage I shoot goes into broadcast tapes and it holds up extremely well compared to the studio cameras
Meep Meep
Meep Meep |
|
|
| NaNaLi |
Just got one from J&R. See below. Great camera...
MSRP - 1699.00
J&R price (at the time) - 1349.00
Chase Corp. discount - 1335.00 + shipping (to save on 8.25% tax) |
|
|
| nwaring |
I have the same one ( Sony DCR-TRV730 Digital8 Handycam) as the Roadrunner and have been extremely happy with it. Here is a MDX picture from the "still" function on the memory stick with the image resized to fit here.
Good luck. Niles |
|
|
| rshanklin |
I am in the same situation. Baby on the way in August.
Last week I ordered:
Sony Mini DV Camcorder TRV27 (I think this is a new model and has the larger 3.5in screeen but only 1.x megapixels) - approx. $900
and
Sony DSC-S85 digital camera - approx. $625 (4+ megapixels)
My thought was to get a good camcorder and a good camera, but not the best of both.
I have not received them yet, therefore cannot give first hand experience. They both sound good on paper and have good reviews.
Good luck. |
|
|
| Maik |
rshanklin,
I also own a pair of Sonys...TRV 10 Camcorder (thr predecessor to the 27) and a Cybershot DSC-F505V still camera. Both are small enough to carry in the same case and both are EASY to use and take fabulous pictures/movies. You will be quite pleased with your selections. |
|
|
| MDXLuvr |
thanx guys and gals.
1+ megapixels is not a lot. maybe i need to go ahead and buy a camcorder, and a digital camera. I just thought it would be easier to carry one instead of two cameras.
any good links for analysis. I checked out about.com, but the info. is a little overwhelming.
thanx again |
|
|
| Maik |
MDXLuvr,
Check out www.megapixel.net for reviews of many digital cameras. Also, you may want to check out zdnet.com and do a search on digital cameras. I have found both sites helpful.
Maik |
|
|
| A2MDXer |
quote:
Originally posted by MDXLuvr
thanx guys and gals.
1+ megapixels is not a lot. maybe i need to go ahead and buy a camcorder, and a digital camera. I just thought it would be easier to carry one instead of two cameras.
It really depends on your intended use. It's a bit more convenient and useful to have both in one unit if you only plan to use the camcorder for pics once in a while. If you plan to make use of the still function as much or more than video then I would get a separate digital camera. Heck, I only have the Sony DSC50 (2.1 Megapixel) but it is still pretty good and very easy to carry. For me, there are just too many times that I want to take pics but don't need/want the camcorder. |
|
|
| DaleB |
quote:
Originally posted by MDXLuvr
thanx guys and gals.
1+ megapixels is not a lot. maybe i need to go ahead and buy a camcorder, and a digital camera. I just thought it would be easier to carry one instead of two cameras.
any good links for analysis. I checked out about.com, but the info. is a little overwhelming.
thanx again
I don't know if you have seen the PC110 in person, but it is VERY small as are the other MiniDV's. |
|
|
| Warzau |
| I want to reiterate that the camera function I use on the PC-110 is for ocassional snapshots. I bought a Nikon 775 for my digital pics, still waiting on the d100. As for size I will post a pic when I get a chance. My baby is demanding today, hmm can you say she is teething. BTW GET READY NOW! Meaning get all the stuff you want for a baby room etc. You will not have time when he/she comes. :) |
|
|
| 'X MOM |
We could not believe the features of this camera for the money.
Panasonic Palmcorder
750x digital zoom
20x optical high-definition zoom
digital image stabilization
2.5 in screen
supplemental light and low light recording
built in digital camera
comes with all required cables for computer
comes with software
comes with memory card for digital pictures
comes with VHSC adapter (just plug the VHSC tape in this and view in VCR with no transfer of tapes
All this for $374 at Wal-Mart. We went for a less expensive model, because we like to upgrade every so often (without heart failure due to technology changes). We have been very happy with this unit quality for the money.
Good luck!:) |
|
|
| Warzau |
quote:
Originally posted by 'X MOM
We could not believe the features of this camera for the money.
Panasonic Palmcorder
All this for $374 at Wal-Mart.
it's a great price I might tell my parents bout this. But MDXluvr wants a DV. |
|
|
| renov8r |
If you don't go with with mini-DV you MUST get at least a Digital8 camera!!!
The quality will make even "mostly blind Aunt Tillie" sit up and go WOW!
With a new baby myself I also HIGHLY recommend get a small cheap "print maker" like the Sony units (PVP-MSH & DPP-MP1 can be had for much less than list...) as grandparents & out-of-town relatives LOVE to put up "fridge shots" ASAP...
Price wise the combinition of features on a DV-8 & printer is far more economical than a DV ( of cource MUCH less than a micro-DV).
I REALLY like a BIG LCD, both becuase I'm very nearsighted, and because it is WAY FUN to play back stuff and let others watch...
You might consider the TRV-840. |
|
|
| roadrunner |
Having used both I'll definitely have to agree with renov8r. There is NO - ZERO - NADA - NO WAY - ZIP comparison between the quality of Digital video and VHS even S-VHS. The digital quality is mind blowing.
More importantly, if you want to edit your video, you can do it directly on a computer with NO loss of quality between the original and the copy. That's something you could NEVER do with analog especially VHS. The first generation would be OK but it was all downhill from there.
Meep Meep |
|
|
| A2MDXer |
| I will defer to the other posters regarding DV quality. However, if you do not intend to use the computer with the camcorder and want a cheap solution, there are alternatives. I have a digital camera so I move my pics to the camera. I don't do much with video on the computer. I have the Sony TRV67 Hi8 video cam, which is outdated by now b/c I bought it 2 years ago. Still, I connect it to my TV using S-Video cable and the resolution is very good - remarkably better than VHS. It probably is not as good as DV (I haven't compared them b/c DV camcorders were pretty expensive 2 years ago) but I am still very happy with the resolution. If I were doing it today I would probably go with DV but if you want to get out cheaper there are satisfactory ways. I have not tried the SVHS but the Sony HI8 (using HI8 tapes) format is pretty good. |
|
|
| roadrunner |
I used HI8 until recently myself and it definitely does have excellent image quality - much better than VHS and competitive or slightly better than S-VHS.
The really great deal is that if you change to Digital8 format most Digital8 camcorder will playback (not record) the HI8 analog tapes. The tape is actually physically the same although recording time per tape is less in Digital8 because of the higher bandwidth. Bottom line, you can digitize all of your old HI8 tapes simply by playing them back through the Digital8 into your computer. This gives you all the quality and ease of editing advantages of digital video on your analog tapes. My large library of HI8 tapes was a major factor in my choice of Digital8 over DV.
Meep Meep |
|
|
| mgmdx |
MDXLuvr,
First, congratulations on the upcoming addition to your family.
Second, I highly recommend a Sony DCR PC5 Mini DV camcorder. I got mine approximately year and a half ago. This is the predecessor to the slightly improved Sony DCR PC9 that is available currently.
This miniDV camcorder is great. It is amazing how so many features can be incorporated into such a tiny package. Small size means I am more likely to bring it with me. Lots of features allow me to create better quality, entertaining footage. The camcorder is convenient to use with the custom handgrip lever, and touch-screen menus are exremely easy and intuitive. Picture quality is excellent, and digital still quality is fine, provided you use it in electronic format and not print it out.
This camcorder can be found on the web for under $1,000. I definitely recommend it. |
|
|
| A2MDXer |
quote:
Originally posted by roadrunner
Bottom line, you can digitize all of your old HI8 tapes simply by playing them back through the Digital8 into your computer. This gives you all the quality and ease of editing advantages of digital video on your analog tapes.
Great tip, RR. I may upgrade in the future and this is good to know. Thanks. |
|
|
| roadrunner |
If you are planning to get into digital video and haven't picked out a computer - be sure to take a look at the Sony Vaio desktops. They come with Firewire ports and lots of video editing software standard. With a Sony digital camcoder (and many other brands) you literally just plug the camera into the Firewire port and start editing - it's just that easy.
Besides, you can get a Celeron processor 1.3GHz; Windows XP Home Edition; 256MB SDRAM; 60.0GB hard drive; DVD-ROM and CD-RW drives for $799 at BestBuy or just a little more for a P4. I use one for all my video editing and I have been very pleased.
Meep Meep |
|
|
| MDXLuvr |
i have been doing some research and have narrowed it down. I will probably go with a miniDV. I am looking at the Canon ZR50($650), Canon Elura100MC($999), Panasonic DV602($700), and a sony TVR25($?). as i had previously mentioned, the theoretical price limit is $1000, however, i am flexible on that. Mainly, i am looking for a camcorder that can take some still pics, and won't be obsolete in 2 years. I do have a couple of questions.
1. Is a CCD of 680k decent for emails? i was under the impression that 2.5 million megapixels are the minimun necessary for good quality digital pics. However, only the high end camcorders have CCD of 1 million or higher. is the rating the same for camcorders and digital cameras(i.e. is 1.3 million megapixels of camcorder equivalent to 1.3 million megapixels of digital camera)?
2. many of DV camcorders come with a 8mb flash memory card. Can i replace this with a 64mb memory card or is the camera limited to only 8mb cards?
I apologize for any dumb questions. any comments or personal experiences with the listed models would be greatly appreciated.
thanx in advance. :) |
|
|
| Warzau |
| I'll answer the second one. Them bastards purposely put in the smallest card to get you to like it, then you want a 64 or a 128 and realize the price. Costco has some decent prices for sony stick$ 58 for 128M. But yes you can get a larger card. |
|
|
| renov8r |
THe 680K pixels are plenty for "snapshots & emails". The image files are signifcantly larger with megapixel cameras.
I thank the ZR50 represents a GREAT value. It has excellent imagine quality and lots of features.
The Elura 100 is overkill, and the kind of product that only stays "top-of-the-line" for a few months.
The TRV25 is priced at $899 at BestBuy & doesn't have $200+ worth of extra features. In fact, I think that Canon priced the ZR50 to aim it right at Sony, as previously Canon was not competively priced.
I would DEFINATELY test drive any of these in a "low light " situation, as with the "new arrival" that will be the norm for a few months. All digiatal cameras work the hardest in low light. I'm not talking about the "nightSHot" mode with IR illumination, just 'regular mode' with normal(low) household light. Even the megapixel cameras often have very avarege/mediacore results in low light... |
|
|
| MDXLuvr |
| thanks guys. I have read alot of good reviews on the ZR50. I think it should most of what i need. I am probably going to go with that one. Any recs on where to buy. |
|
|
| Maik |
"THe 680K pixels are plenty for "snapshots & emails". The image files are signifcantly larger with megapixel cameras"
Sorry to dissagree, but I think that 680K pixels is useless. My Sony Mini DVD has a memory stick and captures stills with 1.1 and I find it to be absolutely useless. The pictures barely have sufficient clarity to print 5x3's. So, unless your only application is to send small pictures via email, I would recommend spending less on the mini DV, (buying one with no memory stick) and also purchase a 3.3 or higher still camera.
Just my opinion |
|
|
| paul123 |
quote:
Originally posted by Warzau
First CONGRATS!!!!
I bought my first DV/digital camera last year for my little girl's birth. Fortunantly 1k is a realistically set price for a dual purpose DV you may go over or under. I bought a Sony PC-110 great DV camcorder, great carl zeiss lens. adequate digital camera 1.2 mega pixel. Really good for those times you are caught without a camera and just have the camcorder. The fun part is when you edit you movies on you computer. I have been editing movies using a firewire connection on my DV camcorder. Its great but takes up alot of space. I like Panys too great price vs Sony. Remember though each have their own propietary memory for digital photo storage. it's late right now so I can get into specifics other than I wrote. but if you have any questions go ahead and IM me.
I have the PC-100 and it's great between the digital pictures and the dv tape it's great. They are small and light. Sony makes the best products!!! |
|
|
| Mocking-DX |
OR
BRANDNEW4LESS.COM |
|
|
| paul123 |
quote:
Originally posted by Mocking-DX
OR
BRANDNEW4LESS.COM
These appear to be low to mid level camcorders, the prices are great though. I would not recommend purchasing the sony high end camcorder from the internet or sony directly. The sony line is available at PC Richard, The WIZ, and Best Buy. All major electronic stores carry the sony camcorders. Those prices are MSRP, when you go to buy you can get for much less. My camcorder was $1750 and I was able to get for $1400, there is a hugh mark-up on these products. Try to wait for a sale day and you can get a great deal. In my opinion no other company compares to the sony products!!! |
|
|
| DaleB |
I picked up the PC110 three months ago for $1200 at onecall.com
They run lots of sales, but you have to be sure you are not being fed options you don't need (what does that sound like?).
But they are very knowledgeable if you call to ask questions and shipping is very fast! |
|
|
| MDXLuvr |
Paul123- thanks for the links/recs. I will go check out the sony. I like sony's, but i feel they usually are not the best bang for the buck.
DaleB- I like onecall, i have bought from them before, very professional and courteous. I will try there website.
thanks
I am still leaning towards the Canon ZR45 or ZR50. I am also looking at the panasonic mini-DV. they look pretty good too.
thnaks!:2: |
|
|
| vip9 |
FWIW, I purchased a Sharp VL-WD450U about 7 months ago and am EXTREMELY happy with the quality of picture on miniDV. Zoom microphone feature is very neat! "Cat's eye" is also great - can shoot in total darkness - can vouch it WORKS!!! Plus, it has the best zoom on the market for the money (both optical and digital - I think 30x optical and 700x digital - or something similar)
It also takes pics - resolution is not the greatest, but it is reasonable. (no built-in flash, nor even a hook up for an external, though)
It has all the modern-standard ports for transferring data (well, video - yes, pics - not quite - provides serial, but no USB)
Price was around $400 (back then), plus Sharp was offering rebates.
If you would want a bigger LCD (from 3" to 4" I think), get WD650 for extra $100.
I think Costco had the best price (although at the time, Etronics.com offered no tax and no s/h, so I went with them)
The only "drawback" for me - it is NOT a "pocket" cam.
Sony is great!!! But when I was looking at the HIGHLY recommended TRV-something-something, all the buttons on the side made me dizzy. Is it worth extra $500 just to know that you have all those extra features YOU WILL NEVER use?!? |
|
|
| Ken Scott |
Hi All,
I did quite a bit of research and found that the Sony TRV27 DV camcorder was best for me. I looked at all of the web sites that sell it and found prices ranging from $650 to $999 (list).
If you look at the "fine print" in Sears ads they claim that they will match "Internet" pricing. I talked to the person at Sears that managed the electronics area and he agreed.
What I did was search the web for the 5 lowest prices for this camera and printed the pages wih the price and shipping than took those into Sears. The salesperson than called to get approval on any of the 5. Sears is aware of which Internet sites have "Grey market" products and which don't.
Anyway, out of the 5 sites I took to them they agreed to one of the prices. I was able to get the Sony TRV 27 for $760. Look at the latest Best Buy ad it is advertised at $999.
I am very happy with the Sony. I hope this helps someone save some bucks!:5: |
|
|
| MDXLuvr |
thanks Ken Scott.:29:
great idea. I will check out their selection. |
|
|
| A2MDXer |
quote:
Originally posted by roadrunner
I used HI8 until recently myself and it definitely does have excellent image quality - much better than VHS and competitive or slightly better than S-VHS.
The really great deal is that if you change to Digital8 format most Digital8 camcorder will playback (not record) the HI8 analog tapes. The tape is actually physically the same although recording time per tape is less in Digital8 because of the higher bandwidth. Bottom line, you can digitize all of your old HI8 tapes simply by playing them back through the Digital8 into your computer. This gives you all the quality and ease of editing advantages of digital video on your analog tapes. My large library of HI8 tapes was a major factor in my choice of Digital8 over DV.
Meep Meep
RR (or anyone else),
We just discovered that our 2 1/2 yr old Sony Hi8 camcorder has bad play heads so it's basically junked (est. repair cost is about $210 - you can buy it new for $300). However, I have at least 50 Hi8 tapes that I must be able to view. Based on that, I think I need to go with the Dig.8 rather than DV (probably Sony TRV240). Other than size (DV camcorders are smaller) what will I be missing with Dig.8 vs. DV? I have about a dozen blank Hi8 tapes - can I record on these using the TRV240 at the lower resolution or can it only play them back? Thanks in advance. |
|
|
| Warzau |
quote:
Originally posted by A2MDXer
RR (or anyone else),
We just discovered that our 2 1/2 yr old Sony Hi8 camcorder has bad play heads so it's basically junked (est. repair cost is about $210 - you can buy it new for $300). However, I have at least 50 Hi8 tapes that I must be able to view. Based on that, I think I need to go with the Dig.8 rather than DV (probably Sony TRV240). Other than size (DV camcorders are smaller) what will I be missing with Dig.8 vs. DV? I have about a dozen blank Hi8 tapes - can I record on these using the TRV240 at the lower resolution or can it only play them back? Thanks in advance.
First where did you take it to have it looked over? Hopefully NOT BB.
I assumed auth Sony. if not do this. Get the dry head cleaner from SONY, and run it maybe 2-3, 3 the most. Same for the recording heads. Press record while in VCR mode and with the tape cleaner in.
This happened to my father in law. I did the above and the camcorder works good as new. |
|
|
| A2MDXer |
quote:
Originally posted by Warzau
First where did you take it to have it looked over? Hopefully NOT BB.
I assumed auth Sony. if not do this. Get the dry head cleaner from SONY, and run it maybe 2-3, 3 the most. Same for the recording heads. Press record while in VCR mode and with the tape cleaner in.
This happened to my father in law. I did the above and the camcorder works good as new.
Thanks for the response. Actually, we first tried to clean the heads with a Scotch Hi8 head cleaner (local store didn't have Sony brand - could this make a big difference??) several times (although I didn't try recording on it, thanks for the tip!) - that did not appear to help. So we called Sony directly and they indicated service is on flat fee but for $200 which seems a bit crazy plus I would be without a camcorder for several weeks (really don't want to do that - I have kids I need to tape!) FWIW, closest auth. Sony repair is 30 miles away. Thanks for the tip. |
|
|
| Warzau |
quote:
Originally posted by A2MDXer
(local store didn't have Sony brand - could this make a big difference??)
It might, my father in law used a wet solution SIMA brand and that didnt work. From looking at the Sony headcleaner tape and a regular tape, the cleaner look more matte than glossy. Perhaps it is more abrasive. The problem with my Father in Law, was the playing heads were fine. But the recording head were dirty. So he was able to play existing tapes but couldnt record, or he could but the playback was awful, was only somewhat viewable when FF or REW.
Good luck!
BTW Camcorders are the only electronics I ever get extended warranties. I got mine from ABT electronics. It starts AFTER the manufacturers expires and covers parts and labor. When I got my Sony DV, there was some white substance on the inside of the lense, which I assumed was lithium grease. Shoot just to look at it was as you said was 200 bucks. The repair was covered. whew. |
|
|
| A2MDXer |
Warzau,
Thanks for the info. Before buying a new one, I will see if I can locate a Sony cleaner (although the Scotch one is dry) and attempt to record while the cleaner is in. We do know that the play heads (not just the record ones) are dirty/worn/bad b/c all of our old tapes are "blotchy" when viewed on our camcorder today (as we made VHS copies of some when recorded, we know those tapes were fine at the time). Anyway, thanks for the info. Worst case I will end shelling out some cash but up with a new toy! |
|
|
| MDXLuvr |
| just to let u all know, i bought the canon zr45 from one call for $590(i think), plus a bunch of accessories for $810. and to think the list price on it was $699 at best buy. |
|
|
|
