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I test drove a Toyota Highlander before putting a downpayment on a MDX. A Highlander, loaded with all the bells and whistles, is similarly equipped and costs about the same as a base MDX.
The Highlander, although bigger than the RX300, is slightly smaller in size, weight, and power than the MDX. For those who can't part with the bucks for a MDX, a Highlander can be had for a lot less money if you are content to live without all the amenities which come standard with the MDX. The six cylinder model I drove had good acceleration and a very pleasant ride.
While the MDX was designed to be more "carlike" than truck based SUVs, the designers of the Highlander clearly suffered from outright schizophrenia in trying to decide whether it was an SUV or minivan. The boxy front looks SUV like, but the rear, without a roof pillar behind the rear doors, looks undeniably vanlike. There is no center console, as in most vans, and the shifter is mounted at the base of the dashboard.
My test drive convinced me that the MDX is a better all around SUV and a better deal for the $$$. If only the MDX, like the Highlander, had a euro-style roof rack which is so much more functional than the MDX rack! |
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I like the Highlander, though not its styling. When discounts become readily available (within a few months), you'll be able to buy a loaded one for about $32k-$33k, and, as you pointed out, a less-loaded one for even less money.
It definitely doesn't have as much room as the MDX, for passengers and cargo, and it definitely doesn't have the MDX's power.
It does have stability control, but it doesn't have an "off" button that will disable it (or rather, the traction control component that reduces or cuts power in some situations to "protect" the driver). There have been some comments on Edmunds Townhall about getting stuck in snow as a result (usually in an offroad situation, or when you've been parked for a while in snowy conditions). |
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| The highlander is just a dressed down version of the rx3oo. |
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different than a "de-luxurified" Lexus. It is a V-A-R-I-A-N-T of the CAMRY platform, just like the Avalon, ES300, and RX300. Each of those vehicles has different dimensions and features as does the Highlander.
While a tad bigger than the RX300 (really, it is) it doesn't YET offer a third seat, though one is almost a sure bet inside of 9 months. The HID's that the RX300 sports may NEVER be available on the Highlander nor will it's trip computer.
The power of Lexus's RX300 is not great, and the heavier Highlander is going to be a dog with a 4, and merely adequate with the (apparently identical)6.
An AWD RX300 stickers at 36K, the V6 "4X4" Highlander is TEN THOUSAND dollars less! Those option sheets are going to be veeeery long. |
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| thetruth |
I test drove the Highlander and was surprised. Almost as powerful as MDX with 6 cyl. With all options not far from MDX-which is not very luxurious-and has much room. I dont need little 3rd row jumper seat of MDX. Read discussions that price will drop down fast and will be able to buy top-line for 2-3 g less than base MDX.
Highlander will be more reliable than MDX-that has problems talked about here and based on troubled Odyssey model. Highlander based on troublefree Camry+Lexus. Both have modern unit body design-MDX have longer base warranty but Highlander has better powertrain warranty. MDX have VTM-4 but Highlander has permanent 4 wheels+traction-control+VSC. So what theres no on-off button for VSC.
I am tired of waiting waiting waiting for MDX. Dealer-jerk probably gypping me and selling my MDX to someone else who pay more than me. Dealer-jerk sez at least 2 more months. Well-in 2 months Highlander 2-3 g less than MDX-right now I think I can buy for 1-2 g less+get immediate delivery. Toyota saleswoman honest with me-Acura salesman is shifty. |
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thetruth: It truly is a shame that you've been treated poorly, but to make things fair here for Acura, my dealer has been a pleasure to deal with. Told me 3-4 months for my MDX, I got it in 6 weeks! Though I've had some initial glitches (i.e. - the Thud from the front control arms needing some tightening), the service department has been courteous, and first rate! And, after those couple of fixes, my baby has been purring ever since!
renov8r: too belittle the Highlander as a "V-A-R-I-A-N-T" of the Camry platform, is inappropriate and a weak argument against it. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE MY MDX!:) But to knock the Highlander for being related to the Camry, you have to knock the MDX for being related to the Accord. :(
Everyone knows the MDX was based on the Odyssey, but what most people forget, is that the Odyssey was based on the Honda Accord. And, quite frankly, the MDX shares more with the Accord than I prefer, I KNOW, I own a 1999 Honda Accord EX 4 Door. Let's just call it even when considering what SUV was based on what.
Prejudices NOT aside, I checked out the Highlander at the San Diego International Auto Show, and the Highlander still sucks compared to my Black MDX with Tour./Navi, TailgateDeflector, Tow, and Chrome Wheels!!! ;)
Besides, I don't know why people are comparing the Highlander with the MDX. It doesn't even have 7 seats. More comparable competition (SUV's with 7 seats) is the Mitsubishi Montero, Dodge Durango, and the new Ford Explorer/Mercury Mountaineer. Of course I would NEVER consider actually buying a Ford Exploder or a Dodge Dingo, but the Montero is a serious option to look at, especially if one is going to do a bit more serious 4-wheeling. Though it only placed 4th, in the Car and Driver shootout of $40k SUVs, one of the key comments by one of the writer's was, "the more I drive it, the more I like it!"
Personally, if the MDX didn't exist, I might have purchased a new Montero. But, the MDX does exist!, and that's why I traded in my old '94 Montero. |
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are just that, different versions.
I did not mean to belittle the Toyota products. I think the Camry is decent platform to base quite a few vehicles on. The same could be said for the Accord.
The reason I mention that Highlander & RX300 are both variants is to help people see that Toyota DID NOT just take a RX300 and pull the luxury off to be left with a Highlander. These are seperate vehicles with plenty of differences that will have implications to all buyers.
The Highlander base model is FWD and 4-cylinder. It is far less costly than anything from Lexus. Even with the 6 and AWD it still stickers for 10K less than the RX300.
The most obvious result this will have is there will be huge disparity in residual value. While this directly affects the lease rates and trade-in calculation that is important to some buyers, this also has an impact on other things that affect any owner. Insurance factors are one area. If your three+ year old vehicle gets "totaled" thourgh theft or collision it will be a bigger hassle to get a fair deal if a lot of the value of your vehicle was in options. Ask Grand Cheeroke owners about this... Other factors that this effects are repairs. Both in the sense that a heavily optioned vehicle has more "add-ons" that can go wrong and in that all those options mean more parts for the dealer/factory to manage. It is far more efficent for the car maker and buyer to have a car with lots of standard equipment and few options. The rate at which things go wrong and subsequently get fixed is more likely to be in the acceptable range. Example: back in the 80's Volvo was offering a large number of special options, but the volume of any option was quite low. If something went wrong the number of techs who could fix it was quite small AND the delays for parts was very long. It made Volvo owners quite unhappy and they suffered with lots of optional equipement that was busted or would take months for replacement...
While I suspect that the Highlander will never suffer from the same slim volumes that plagued Volvo, the principle is still the same -- if you get a feature laden vehicle, try to be sure most of those features are standard & the vehicle is not too uncommon. I have no idea what mix Toyota is aiming for among Highlanders -- they won't target too high on the luxury end lest they cut into RX300 sales. The bottom end they run into there own RAV. If they target midline they may hurt Camry sales. I don't have special knowledge of their internal goals, this is just information that anyone can see looking at Toyota's pricing.
That said, I feel even better about MDX and Acura/Honda. The terrfic sales of the MDX are coming based on no "SUV heritage" and give Acura & Honda a whole new momentum for growth. Highlander will probably be successful, though there will be factors internally that will likely limit its overall success.
Finally I have to agree ucsdtriton: other than the high regard for manufacturing that Toyota & Honda share there is little that the Highlander & MDX. One is clearly a luxury vehicle with standard seating for seven, sunroof, AWD, 240 hpULE VTEC V6, 17" wheels, leather seats et cetera, while the Highlander is a whole different ball of wax...
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quote:
Originally posted by thetruth
I test drove the Highlander and was surprised. Almost as powerful as MDX with 6 cyl. With all options not far from MDX-which is not very luxurious-and has much room. I dont need little 3rd row jumper seat of MDX. Read discussions that price will drop down fast and will be able to buy top-line for 2-3 g less than base MDX.
Highlander will be more reliable than MDX-that has problems talked about here and based on troubled Odyssey model. Highlander based on troublefree Camry+Lexus. Both have modern unit body design-MDX have longer base warranty but Highlander has better powertrain warranty. MDX have VTM-4 but Highlander has permanent 4 wheels+traction-control+VSC. So what theres no on-off button for VSC.
I am tired of waiting waiting waiting for MDX. Dealer-jerk probably gypping me and selling my MDX to someone else who pay more than me. Dealer-jerk sez at least 2 more months. Well-in 2 months Highlander 2-3 g less than MDX-right now I think I can buy for 1-2 g less+get immediate delivery. Toyota saleswoman honest with me-Acura salesman is shifty.
The Highlander strikes me as a "next size" up Subaru Forrester. Kind of like a big all wheel drive station wagon. And the Limited has a sticker price of $34K. Yikes! One of the car magazines that covered the MDX winter demonstration in Colorado last year was sharply critical of the RX300's 4 wheel drive system saying that by the time it reacted the car was usually headed for a ditch. I'd imagine the Highlander will perform the same way. There are so many sub-categories of "SUV" now that it truly makes comparisons difficult. I'm sure the Highlander will be well built and that Toyota will sell everyone they can produce. |
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I was going to put a deposit down on an MDX, but I just had a chance to test drive a Highlander, and I changed my mind. While the Highlander is not of the same breed as the MDX, it is a very pleasant vehicle to drive, and it has a good amount of space (cargo space is the same as my 1993 Exploder, and the seating space seemed comparable to the MDX).
While I agree that one should not bother with the Highlander if you want the works, a Highlander can be had for $4000 less at MSRP if you don't mind going back to cloth seats and a manual a/c (I'm sure there are a few other goodies that the MDX has, but I'd rather not dig out the equipment lists). Also, at least in the Boston area, you can start to get deals under MSRP, so the price difference is even greater. The biggest reason, however, is that I'll be driving a Highlander within at most a month or so, long before those on the 6-7 month MDX waiting lists get their vehicles.
Best of luck to those who have or will have an MDX. It's the best luxury-level SUV for the price. Maybe when I'm ready to retire my 1998 Subaru Outback, I'll be ready for an MDX... |
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I just test drove the Highlander - something to do while I WAIT for my MDX :p.
Overall, I was pleasantly surprised. The Toyota handled well and went through the paces in both city and freeway traffic. It was responsive and most of the controls were within intuitive reach.
The interior was well finished but definitely seemed more trucklike and less luxury car than the MDX, even thought the sales pitch included multiple references to the fact that the Highlander was really just a slightly larger rebadged RX300. (Hmmmm. Really?)
The killer, though, was that the luxury edition 2WD Highlander stickered at close to $33k and the salesman told me that (even though they had two dozen Highlanders on their lot) they were getting $2500 over MSRP. "NOT FROM ME!" I told him. I'll keep waiting for my MSRP priced MDX. If the Highlander were truly $3-5k less I might consider it, but for the same dollars, the MDX is the hands down winner.
;)
Liberty |
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I have to stand corrected on the timeframe on my Highlander...from test drive to negotiations and then to delivery was around 3 weeks.
Here's my comparisons/opinions in various areas:
Interior room (front): HL seems better; more headroom than MDX, and leg space in front passenger side of MDX is a bit tight
Interior room (rear): HL wins here if you don't need to put 3 passengers there (MDX is around 5 inches wider, I believe); better headroom and legroom in the HL.
Cargo space: MDX wins here; HL doesn't have 3rd seat, either (which we didn't care about, since our 8 year old son barely fit in it anyway). MDX, however, is a bigger vehicle, so fitting it in parking spaces and in my garage would be more of a challenge. Also, the HL has a decent amount of cargo space, and you can fold down the front seat all the way back for carrying long items.
Power: MDX has an edge here, but not a significant one.
Handling/Ride: MDX ride isn't as stiff, but the HL has less body lean.
Braking: MDX has better brake pedal feel (HL has mushy brake pedal) but the HL was stronger in a panic stop.
Driving in snow: Not sure; MDX was great on the test drive, but the HL should also do OK here.
Luxury "feel": MDX wins here; HL, even with the preferred package, does not feel like a luxury SUV.
So why did I buy the HL? Able to get delivery well before the end of the summer, and $29,500 for my HL ($1,500 UNDER MSRP, others could do even better) vs. $35,000 for the MDX (full MSRP, no chances for discount). Main things I gave up were leather seats, power seat on passenger side seat, side airbags, and the 3rd row seat. Even got my first choice for colors.
Best of luck to those waiting for their MDXs. Hope it is worth the wait for you, it wasn't for me...
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