| Spencer |
Hi!
Just wanted to say that this is my first post and you guys are really making me want a MDX. I have an "older" Ford Explorer and my wife tells me I need to buy a SUV that says " I have arrived". I have it narrowed down to the 03 4Runner and of course the MDX.
I happened to talk to a guy that had just bought the 03 4R and he said he chose it because he had the option to choose when it was in 4 wheel drive compared to the mercy of the all wheel drive of the MDX. I would really appreciate some of your thoughts on the pros and cons on this. Any concerns on just having the all wheel drive? Thanks!:confused: :confused: :confused:
Spencer |
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| DaleB |
The MDX is not a champion off-roader. But it does better than many expected.
Where is really shines is in the 'slick'. It has excellent traction. It is normally a 2 wheel (front-driven) vehicle, until you put demand on it. Then torque is delivered at the right proportion to the rear wheels also.
This is very well designed, and it performs as designed. It does great on icy, wet, and snowy roads.
And it does all this with a relatively compact rear differential with clutch packs to apply drive to the rear wheels as needed. This is computed by sophisticated on-board electronics.
There is no heavy transfer box assembly normally associated with a 4X4.
Again, it's not designed to climb boulders, so you need to assess what you want it for. It does have a low speed mode where you can lock all 4 wheels for help driving out of ruts or ravines, or such. It automatically disengages above 18 mph.
You can search posts on here about owner's experiences in the white stuff, and as well as all sorts of other adventures, including a drive into Alaska's interior. |
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| dbauchat |
You really need to decide how you're going to use the vehicle. If you are looking to do serious off-roading, the MDX is probably not the right choice. You'll be better off choosing a 4 wheel platform that has both Hi & Low 4WD and that you can add skid plates to.
On the other hand, if you're buying a vehicle to get you thru snow, ice, and the occasional washboard gravel road and to handle it with style and comfort, the MDX can't be beat. (Note: There is one member that drove their X thru northern Canada into the artic circle on some unbelievably rough roads. So the X doesn't exactly wimp out there...)
When you're not driving thru crap, the MDX provides superb ride and handling. By the way, the MDX has decent towing capacity, enough to pull a 4500# boat. Last I knew the 4Runner had a pretty limited towing capacity.
Good luck making your choice.
PS - My MDX replaced a 99 Ford Expedition and I looked, and drove, the 2002 Explorer & Mountaineer extensively before making my decision. I haven't been thrilled with my last two Fords because they kept blowing head gaskets.
The X is light years ahead of the Expedition in ride, handling, & performance, but sacrifices towing capacity. Compared to the Explorer, I think the overall quality is better, the MDX is quieter, with better ride & handling.
PSS - I used my Expedition to pull stumps out and to occasionally skid logs from my woodlot. 4WD low & locking differentials were required. I'd never dream of abusing my MDX that way. |
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| renov8r |
I remember asking GatorGreg and some of the other "hard core" off roaders IF that was a valid concern. Basically, it is NOT.
The thing that makes a difference is IF you are HARD CORE it does help to have a SEPARATE LOW RANGE so that you can use maximum torque at 'crawling' speeds.
Simply being able to engage/disengage 4WD is meaningless. In fact the 'old style' engagement system found on some vehicles that requires wheel rotation to lock-up 4WD would be a BIG disadvantage in many situations. The electro-magnetic engagement system of the VTM-4 gives up little/nothing to other kinds of 4WD is 99% of the low traction situations encountered in normal driving -- ON Road or OFF!
If you are talking about "off roading" as a past-time, that is whole other ball of 'mud'. The real issues that DO make sense if you want/need a 4Runner are the low range available with some combinations,the locking differentials, the wheel articulation, the beefy truck based suspension mounting points and subtle differences in RPM & torque.
I stopped by a Toyo dealer a while ago and the not-so-well-informed sales guy tried spouting the same "selectable is better" line -- it just is NOT that simple! |
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| presten |
| Excellent thoughts all....I am not an "off roader" in the heavy duty sense but do like to explore the occasional ungated "back road" to who knows where. I have found that the MDX does a very good job in this case and although you are never really aware of when it moves in and out of 4-wheel mode...it just seems to work! I did do a little experiment recently during a particularly rainy period. I found a rural paved road that had a really muddy gooey shoulder but just a wet paved surface....put the right wheels in the mud and stomped on the throttle. Off we went with nary a wheel spin or swerve. I would say that is a pretty good performance. I have a Toyota Tundra as well and love it but when we are driving in marginal conditions I have to be always thinking of 2-wheel vs. 4-wheel mode and should I switch. When I am out hunting in really rough conditions then it is OK to leave it in 4-wheel all the time... it's just those marginal conditions that are a problem. It seems that most of the time we wait on snow covered highways until we slip a couple of times and then slow down to engage the 4-wheel system. With the MDX...it beats us to the punch and does it all automatically. Very nice! Love that car and more importantly so does my wife...she says it gives her more confidence driving in slick conditions than any vehicle we have ever owned including the Tundra and our previous Pathfinder. |
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| tigmd99 |
AWD vs. 4WD:
AWD is great for 95% of people. Everyone's comments above is correct with a one correction:
4Runners have always been able to tow 5000 lbs since 1996. For the 2003 4Runner, there may be an option later next year that will increase the towing capacity to 6500 lbs...probably a bolt-on hitch, instead of using the integrated hitch. This option IS available on the GX470, so i assume it will be the same for 4Runner.
If you want an all-weather SUV, then MDX is the vehicle to have. If you want something that can withstand off-roading punishment, then you may want to look elsewhere.
One thing i would like to add...AWD systems are REACTIVE. That is, the computer must detect slippage before it activates the AWD system. How long does it take for it to "react" is the key question and may affect the safety of it's passengers.
On 4wd systems, like the 4Runner, you can leave the SUV in 4wd on ALL surface. If you do so, then this system is PRO-ACTIVE. That is, traction is ALWAYS there...so there is no reaction time by the computer system.
Having said that i have not heard any problems with the MDX in rough weather. |
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| A2MDXer |
quote:
Originally posted by tigmd99
One thing i would like to add...AWD systems are REACTIVE. That is, the computer must detect slippage before it activates the AWD system. How long does it take for it to "react" is the key question and may affect the safety of it's passengers.
On 4wd systems, like the 4Runner, you can leave the SUV in 4wd on ALL surface. If you do so, then this system is PRO-ACTIVE. That is, traction is ALWAYS there...so there is no reaction time by the computer system.
Having said that i have not heard any problems with the MDX in rough weather.
Of course, as has been discussed here many times before, the MDX system is not the classic AWD reactive system in that (in some situations) it does not wait for wheel slippage, so in common terms it has the advantage (vs. AWD reactive-only systems) of being "pro-active" and eliminates any concern about reaction time from wheel slippage. |
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| rdwong |
After only 800 miles on my new X, I just got back from a trip to Reno and had to traverse over Donner Summit. It was snowy and cold but the X made me and my family feel as if we were in our living room. Aside from the long wait because they closed down Hwy 80 for an hour (which we passed the time watching a movie on the RES) the ride was flawless. I was originally concerned with the ability of the X to perform on these conditions, but I was very quickly comforted by the results. There was plenty of ice and snow on the road and the X went through it as if it was not even there. It was not a blizzard condition, but if it was I wouldn't be on the road any way. :26:
I would caution everyone that while the X anticipated and compensated for the road conditions, common sense should not be tossed aside. Don't try to exceed speed limits that is not normally safe, because while YOU have control over YOUR vehicle, the rest of the yahoo's out there may not and you want to leave yourself with plenty of room thus avoiding that major ding on the side of your brand new X.:mblah:
Bottom line is that the confidence level has greatly improved with me and my X on any road condition. I even tested out how the ABS would perform and intentionally braked (at a low speed) when the left side of the car went over ice. I felt the ABS shutter, but the X did not shift out of control. Pretty good peace of mind.
:rolleyes: |
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| buhmabee |
quote:
Originally posted by Spencer
I have an "older" Ford Explorer and my wife tells me I need to buy a SUV that says " I have arrived". Spencer
Hey Spencer,
Seeing as how my fellow X owners have addressed the offroad issue I will address this one. When you pull up where ever it is you end up pulling up to, a 4Runner says nice SUV. When you pull up in an MDX it does say "I have arrived."
Good luck |
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| Redwing |
Grant it things have come a long way, but I use to own a Blazer back in to 80's You could like the drive or go to 4 wheel. As noticed above, and I agree, the MDX system is a bit more reactive. For true off-roading in thick stuff the 4 runner may be better, but I don't know how rugged the offroading is that you have in mind. If it's not too tough, the X will rule and you could just focus on the task of driving and let the x do the work. (one still has the option to "force" the VTM at low speeds.)
It just seems one gets much more with the X. Good luck, Toyota typcially makes good products as well.
BTW, I've got an 01 and love it and the drive. Never been stuck and icy/slushy roads haven't concerned me much- except the stopping part. |
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| tigmd99 |
A2MDXer,
Nope, MDX is REACTIVE. It is ONLY proactive when accelerating from a stop OR when you turn on VTM-4LOCK. Otherwise, it is reactive! When driving on the highway, the MDX is very much like the Honda CRV, which is reactive, BUT it's AWD system is controlled by a computer instead of mechanical pumps. On the highway, all power goes to the front wheels...thus, it acts like FWD cars. ONLY when there is slippage, does power get routed to the rear differential.
Thanks. |
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| vicpai |
quote:
Originally posted by buhmabee
Hey Spencer,
Seeing as how my fellow X owners have addressed the offroad issue I will address this one. When you pull up where ever it is you end up pulling up to, a 4Runner says nice SUV. When you pull up in an MDX it does say "I have arrived."
Good luck
.............on this one!! Everywhere I go, I can't even begin to keep count of the compliments, oooohs and aaaahs I get!! :29: .......I'm really not into this type of thing, but all this attention is sure nice!! :2: |
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| vicpai |
quote:
Originally posted by tigmd99
A2MDXer,
Nope, MDX is REACTIVE. It is ONLY proactive when accelerating from a stop OR when you turn on VTM-4LOCK. Otherwise, it is reactive! When driving on the highway, the MDX is very much like the Honda CRV, which is reactive, BUT it's AWD system is controlled by a computer instead of mechanical pumps. On the highway, all power goes to the front wheels...thus, it acts like FWD cars. ONLY when there is slippage, does power get routed to the rear differential.
Thanks.
.......to your statement. If I'm not mistaken, the VTM-4 system is PROACTIVE anytime there is acceleration, not just when accelerating from a stop. Depending on the amount of acceleration, varying amounts of torque are sent to the rear wheels. Additionally, when cornering too, some torque is sent to the rear wheels to counter understeer. However, when the MDX is cruising, it goes into FRONT WHEEL DRIVE mode, and the system becomes REACTIVE! |
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| tigmd99 |
| Vicpai, that is pretty cool then! |
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| wmquan |
| Maybe we should just say it's mostly reactive but fairly proactive? :D |
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| khaug |
Spencer, you should be aware that only the V6-engined '03 4Runners have selectable 4WD. The V8 4WD models use a full-time 4WD system, and can't be shifted out of 4WD.
I chose the 4Runner V8 because I tow a heavy trailer and wanted the low-speed torque. Had I not needed the tow capacity, I probably would have gone with an MDX, or bought something other than an SUV. I agree with all the comments about the relative off-road merits of the two vehicles, but the 4Runner's off-road abilities will be totally wasted on me (and, I suspect, most others).
Regards.
-Karl
-'03 4Runner Limited, Titanium, 4WD, V8 |
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| A2MDXer |
quote:
Originally posted by vicpai
.......to your statement. If I'm not mistaken, the VTM-4 system is PROACTIVE anytime there is acceleration, not just when accelerating from a stop. Depending on the amount of acceleration, varying amounts of torque are sent to the rear wheels. Additionally, when cornering too, some torque is sent to the rear wheels to counter understeer. However, when the MDX is cruising, it goes into FRONT WHEEL DRIVE mode, and the system becomes REACTIVE!
Yes, this is exactly what I meant when I said "in certain situations". I was not claiming the MDX is proactive in all situations but it is in some and has the option of being "locked in" at low speeds. Thus it has an advantage over purely reactive systems. I didn't want to go into detail b/c we have discussed this many times. |
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